Re: Esprit 728 keypads

[tourman <robercampbell@xxxxxxxxx>]

On Feb 24, 9:02=A0pm, mleuck <m.le...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> On Feb 24, 5:30=A0pm, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Feb 24, 1:44=A0pm, Jim <alarmi...@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 24, 9:13 am, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > > > RHC: I actually wrote the president of Paradox about this issue of =
non
> > > > compatibility. Needless to say, I didn't even get the courtesy of a
> > > > reply.
>
> > > > In speaking with others within the company, the whole idea of backw=
ard
> > > > compatibility was "poo pooed" as a non issue, and not even practica=
l
> > > > if they plan to be innovative in their development of new products =
for
> > > > the market.This is classic big company "bullshit" thinking -sell li=
ke
> > > > hell and forget support.!!!! Who the hell do they think thieir
> > > > customers are??? Piss dealers off and they doom themselves in the l=
ong
> > > > run
>
> > > > One thing I have noticed in this industry, most alarm people are qu=
ite
> > > > "reactionary" and somewhat unforgiving of companies that mess with
> > > > their business. All it takes is one bad experience with a comany's
> > > > products and they remember forever - even after the original proble=
m
> > > > has been resolved.
>
> > > > Frankly, if they didn't make such good products, I would consider
> > > > going back to DSC for my installations. As it is, I do more DSC
> > > > installs now than I had ever planned to do......
>
> > > > Paradox, I hope you're listening (but then you have to care as
> > > > well.....)-
>
> > > I'm sure that everyone is aware that this is not a new "problem" that
> > > every manufacturer has to deal with.
>
> > > There's a point that every manufacturer has to decide upon where they
> > > break the line. They can't keep making product backward compatable
> > > forever. It becomes increasingly more expensive to design in backward
> > > compatability as time moves on. It doesn't make sense to make a new
> > > product more expensive for that diminishing quantity of product in th=
e
> > > field and the fewer and fewer installers that want to support them.
> > > There seems to be something in some installers book of rules that say=
s
> > > that a manufacturer has an obligation to produce a =A0product that ha=
s
> > > an eternal life expectancy and period of support. In reality they
> > > don't. And it's actually a marketing decision as well as bottom line.
> > > Their dilemma is ..... How many installers are we going to lose or
> > > piss off or please by the increased cost of new design that includes
> > > backward compatability .... versus the number of installers we're
> > > going tolose or piss off by cutting off backward compatability? =A0Al=
so
> > > in consideration of pricing new product and adding features to meet
> > > compitition, do we eliminate new inovations in new products in favor
> > > of providing backward compatability?
>
> > > Every manufacturer will draw a different line.
>
> > > As for me, I think about 10 years back is good enough. To off-set
> > > that, I keep a few of each of old equipment that I've pulled out, tha=
t
> > > I think I might be able to use in the future. I keep programing chips
> > > and used keypads mostly and some panels. =A0And, if it so happens tha=
t I
> > > don't have the item that's needed, =A0then the client will just have =
to
> > > bite the bullet and get something new. Could I lose an account over
> > > it? Yeah, sometimes. But if it's a real hardship case, there are
> > > panels out now that are inexpensive enough that will take the place o=
f
> > > some of this old equipment very easily. In most of these instances, i=
f
> > > I don't have the necessary part, I''ll just switch out the equipment
> > > for cost, just to help out. These are usually retired folks or widowe=
d
> > > singles that are on limited income.
>
> > > To me, this is not a big issue but I can appriciate that it could be
> > > for larger companys.
>
> > RHC: Jim, I understand the the rational =A0behind what both you and Mar=
k
> > are saying, and I don't disagree in those cases. You are talking
> > compatibility for some ten years here; however, with Paradox, we are
> > talking only a couple of years at most. For example, they brought out
> > the Spectra line 1728/1738 panels and they were latest and greatest
> > for only about two years. Then they announced the newer Magellan
> > 5000/6000/7000 series, which looked identical to the older line, but
> > were not in any way compatible. Even the memory key being used for the
> > new line is different from the old. The keypads are not compatible,
> > nor are the expander boards....nothing. AND they stopped production
> > totally of the older equipment totally, so nothing is now available to
> > buy to replace boards or keypads that are defective.
>
> > Two years is not an acceptable time for this kind of thing to happen
> > in my opinion.There are a number of other products they have done this
> > with as well
>
> I can understand your anger at that, what has always confused me about
> Paradox was the sheer number of panels they have, I thought the
> Magellan was the all in one system but it appears to also be a
> standard panel?

RHC: Magellan is an all in one device, but Magellan is the name of a
line of panels including the SP series of devices and also wireless
devices. Its kinda confusing actually They have the SP5000, 5050, 6000
and 7000 panels which are their standard (right now). If they screw
with these like they did with the Spectra series, I'm gone: they're
history......