Re: Esprit 728 keypads

[mleuck <m.leuck@xxxxxxxxx>]

On Feb 24, 5:30=A0pm, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> On Feb 24, 1:44=A0pm, Jim <alarmi...@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Feb 24, 9:13 am, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > > RHC: I actually wrote the president of Paradox about this issue of no=
n
> > > compatibility. Needless to say, I didn't even get the courtesy of a
> > > reply.
>
> > > In speaking with others within the company, the whole idea of backwar=
d
> > > compatibility was "poo pooed" as a non issue, and not even practical
> > > if they plan to be innovative in their development of new products fo=
r
> > > the market.This is classic big company "bullshit" thinking -sell like
> > > hell and forget support.!!!! Who the hell do they think thieir
> > > customers are??? Piss dealers off and they doom themselves in the lon=
g
> > > run
>
> > > One thing I have noticed in this industry, most alarm people are quit=
e
> > > "reactionary" and somewhat unforgiving of companies that mess with
> > > their business. All it takes is one bad experience with a comany's
> > > products and they remember forever - even after the original problem
> > > has been resolved.
>
> > > Frankly, if they didn't make such good products, I would consider
> > > going back to DSC for my installations. As it is, I do more DSC
> > > installs now than I had ever planned to do......
>
> > > Paradox, I hope you're listening (but then you have to care as
> > > well.....)-
>
> > I'm sure that everyone is aware that this is not a new "problem" that
> > every manufacturer has to deal with.
>
> > There's a point that every manufacturer has to decide upon where they
> > break the line. They can't keep making product backward compatable
> > forever. It becomes increasingly more expensive to design in backward
> > compatability as time moves on. It doesn't make sense to make a new
> > product more expensive for that diminishing quantity of product in the
> > field and the fewer and fewer installers that want to support them.
> > There seems to be something in some installers book of rules that says
> > that a manufacturer has an obligation to produce a =A0product that has
> > an eternal life expectancy and period of support. In reality they
> > don't. And it's actually a marketing decision as well as bottom line.
> > Their dilemma is ..... How many installers are we going to lose or
> > piss off or please by the increased cost of new design that includes
> > backward compatability .... versus the number of installers we're
> > going tolose or piss off by cutting off backward compatability? =A0Also
> > in consideration of pricing new product and adding features to meet
> > compitition, do we eliminate new inovations in new products in favor
> > of providing backward compatability?
>
> > Every manufacturer will draw a different line.
>
> > As for me, I think about 10 years back is good enough. To off-set
> > that, I keep a few of each of old equipment that I've pulled out, that
> > I think I might be able to use in the future. I keep programing chips
> > and used keypads mostly and some panels. =A0And, if it so happens that =
I
> > don't have the item that's needed, =A0then the client will just have to
> > bite the bullet and get something new. Could I lose an account over
> > it? Yeah, sometimes. But if it's a real hardship case, there are
> > panels out now that are inexpensive enough that will take the place of
> > some of this old equipment very easily. In most of these instances, if
> > I don't have the necessary part, I''ll just switch out the equipment
> > for cost, just to help out. These are usually retired folks or widowed
> > singles that are on limited income.
>
> > To me, this is not a big issue but I can appriciate that it could be
> > for larger companys.
>
> RHC: Jim, I understand the the rational =A0behind what both you and Mark
> are saying, and I don't disagree in those cases. You are talking
> compatibility for some ten years here; however, with Paradox, we are
> talking only a couple of years at most. For example, they brought out
> the Spectra line 1728/1738 panels and they were latest and greatest
> for only about two years. Then they announced the newer Magellan
> 5000/6000/7000 series, which looked identical to the older line, but
> were not in any way compatible. Even the memory key being used for the
> new line is different from the old. The keypads are not compatible,
> nor are the expander boards....nothing. AND they stopped production
> totally of the older equipment totally, so nothing is now available to
> buy to replace boards or keypads that are defective.
>
> Two years is not an acceptable time for this kind of thing to happen
> in my opinion.There are a number of other products they have done this
> with as well

I can understand your anger at that, what has always confused me about
Paradox was the sheer number of panels they have, I thought the
Magellan was the all in one system but it appears to also be a
standard panel?