Re: Wire type for peripherals on residential burg/fire panels

[Effenpig1 <dirtyspicevent@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Dec 18, 9:34=A0pm, "Crash Gordon" <webmas...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
> how would using fire wire on a keypad be considered fire "protection" ? m=
ost
> fire systems don't provide protection...detection yes.
>
> is there code on this?
>
> --
> **Crash Gordon**
>
> "Kid" <k...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>
> news:4b277cf7$0$8227$c5fe31e7@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> > if there is a fire panic button on the keypad then there is fire
> > protection.
>
> > "Crash Gordon" <webmas...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> >news:4b2725cd$1$89869$815e3792@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> It can't hurt, but if there's no fire detection to begin with on a
> >> residential system....why would you want to?...because there might be =
one
> >> day?
>
> >> --
> >> **Crash Gordon**
>
> >> "Effenpig1" <dirtyspicev...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> >>news:e332db35-aae0-4d62-822f-bd94dfdd7cb9@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx=
..
> >>> On Dec 13, 7:31 pm, nick markowitz <nmarkow...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >>>> On Dec 13, 7:15 pm, Effenpig1 <dirtyspicev...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> >>>> > For residential burg I use 18 gauge FPLR to wire keypads,
> >>>> > transformers, sirens, and of course fire devices ( and CO). I do t=
his
> >>>> > whether or not the system will include fire devices initially. My
> >>>> > thought being if I don't and the owner decides on fire protection
> >>>> > down
> >>>> > the line it would be more work.
>
> >>>> > Curious as to how other installers deal with this. The company I
> >>>> > worked for before I started my business never used fire wire, even
> >>>> > for
> >>>> > the fire devices themselves.
>
> >>>> Let me put it to you this way
> >>>> One of the side things I do is Fire Investigation for Insurance
> >>>> companies.
> >>>> the very first question they ask on form they send for a failure
> >>>> analysis investigation asks. Does the system meet all codes code at
> >>>> time it was installed.
> >>>> 2nd question is would system have functioned properly had code been
> >>>> followed. 3rd question is were proper permits and inspections done.
>
> >>>> If I walk in on a system that has failed and find telco or any other
> >>>> type of wire being used for the smokes and heats etc. that would be =
a
> >>>> violation of NEC and NFPA -ICC
>
> >>>> You are doing the right thing. absolutely the others are leaving the=
m
> >>>> selves exposed. and no matter how you write a contract sooner or lat=
er
> >>>> you will get popped and even if you win what it is costing in time a=
nd
> >>>> money will be horrendous.
> >>>> I got sued because an asshole customer was to lazy to check his syst=
em
> >>>> after it went off and police looked in and saw no one because they
> >>>> were in a back room breaking into the safe.
> >>>> Thank God jury saw this case for what it was but it still cost how
> >>>> many days time and money defending it.
>
> >>> What about wiring the keypad, siren,and transformer with FPLR on
> >>> systems with fire? How about systems without fire in case of future
> >>> add-ons, any one think either is unnecessary?

I would think only sprinkler systems and the like would be protection.