Re: I think they've done it again.

["bruceR" <nospam@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

I tested the UPB Starter kit for a few days but found that the signal would
not make it througout the house. IOW, no better than X10 in MY application.
I was going to play with it some more but then the desktop controller
stopped working and I put it all aside.


"Dave Houston" <nobody@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:44a11016.320988328@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Bruce,
>
> I recall you also reported some problems when you tested UPB but cannot
> recall the details.
>
> "bruceR" <nospam@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>>Well, here is one guy who has the problem. Before the coversion was
>>complete
>>Insteon devices were making certain Leviton X10 switches flicker and now
>>that I'm 98% Insteon I still get some flickering. I will changeout the
>>offenders when a fix is availble.
>>
>>
>>"Marc F Hult" <MFHult@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>>news:aakv921aot72gv63ubsp3ec8niucgt4vd5@xxxxxxxxxx
>>> On Sun, 25 Jun 2006 17:30:15 -0400, Marc F Hult
>>> <MFHult@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>>> <g2ut92do7d99l555jouk9fmttc15jefbv6@xxxxxxx>:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>I'll look at the reports some more so as to be able to respond more
>>>>usefully. I think that i understand your timing question and add the
>>> comment
>>>>that when I looked at line noise created by generic and X-10 WS467
>>>>dimmers
>>>>several years ago, I found that the highest peak voltages were measured
>>>>at
>>>>about the 1/4 the RMS output IIRC.
>>>>
>>>>Recall that an inductor 'stretches' the duration of a pulse, so the
>>>>delay
>>>>caused by the L1 choke  might be long enough to trigger gate triggering
>>>>in
>>> a
>>>>second TRIAC in a second dimmer when the delayed/stretched INSTEON PLC
>>>>signal is _added_ to the TRIAC noise from the INSTEON TRIAC at some time
>>>>significantly after zero crossing and that signal is not sufficiently
>>>>attenuated (there are two issues here; timing and noise/signal
>>>>strength.)
>>>>
>>>>Later ... Marc
>>>>Marc_F_Hult
>>>>www.ECOntrol.org
>>>
>>>
>>> I conclude that as a an actual performance problem, this is a tempest in
>>> a
>>> teapot: a problem nobody here has actually experienced (not surprising
>>> since
>>> it seems most folks participating in this thread may not even have an
>>> INSTEON installation ;-)
>>>
>>> An INSTEON rep wrote in the thread I cited previously that: "We saw this
>>> problem during the beta testing of the SwitchLinc dimmer in two units
>>> out
>>> of
>>> 800 beta samples." and goes on to give contact info for a person with a
>>> flickering dimmer to be able to contact Smarthome on a Sunday to arrange
>>> for
>>> a replacement dimmer. The same rep reports that INSTEON spent $40,000
>>> troubleshooting and replacing possible off-spec components before
>>> shipping
>>> but apparently a few slipped through (or at least that is one
>>> explanation
>>> offered).
>>>
>>> According to INSTEON, the dimmers with revised/QA'd TRIAsC/chokes  will
>>> be
>>> shipping 4th Qtr which will presumably reduce problem frequency closer
>>> even
>>> to zero. I haven't experienced any problems myself nor apparently have
>>> the
>>> vast majority of other INSTEON users. So the solution to this apparently
>>> infrequent problem is at hand.
>>>
>>> As to the challenge of trying to divine the cause, first step is problem
>>> definition which is problematic because reports are not consistent. I'd
>>> be
>>> more interested if there was a way of testing the various hypotheses
>>> posed.
>>> Absent an actual case of flickering on which to test causes and
>>> remedies,
>>> another way would be (eg Spice) modeling but that's more work than I'm
>>> inclined to put into this particular academic exercise.
>>>
>>> ... Marc
>>> Marc_F_Hult
>>> www.ECOntrol.org
>>
>