Re: CFLs flicker when Wall Swtich WS467 is OFF

["Robert Green" <ROBERT_GREEN1963@xxxxxxxxx>]

"Jim Hewitt" <jim.hewitt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:frmkid$qan$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> "Robert Green" <ROBERT_GREEN1963@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:GZCdnZnXO6wlP0banZ2dnUVZ_veinZ2d@xxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > Clearly, premature failure is going to eat into your saving,
particularly
> > if
> > you can't get reasonable warranty replacements.  My suggestion is to
mark
> > all the bulbs going into the can fixtures with a Sharpie so you can tell
> > how
> > long they last.
> > ...
> >  I have
> > noticed that most of my new light fixtures have much more room around
the
> > lamp sockets to accommodate the much-larger-than-tungsten CFL lamp
bases.
> > The failures I had were in older style reflector lamps that accommodated
> > large CFL bulbs, but didn't provide a whole lot of space around the
> > electronics "bay" of the CFL bulb.
>
> I did mark them all!  We'll just have to hpe for reasonable warranty
> replacements (do they ALL require you to send in the bad bulb?  That lmost
> defeats the entire purpose since I could almost buy a new one for the same
> price.  Oh, good marketing ploy!)
> And my recessed lighting cans are just that - complete, empty cans with a
> socket in the middle at the top.  So they will have lots of room around
the
> electronics part of the bulb.  I only now realized this when talking to a
> friend who told me that he couldn't get his CFL flood lights to fit into
his
> precisely because there is no such room.  So maybe I'll be OK here.

If my experience with cooling ever-hotter generations of CPU generalizes to
CFL cooing, there has to be a pretty good and unimpeded airflow to keep the
temperatures down.  A very big fixture could still overheat if there's no
exit at the top for the hot air.  Lots of recessed lighting elements were
designed to tolerate high heat rather than dissipate it.  That's not what
CFL's need.

I'd do a test run.  If, after six months, if I had premature failures or
very slow starting or serious darkening I would measure the temperature at
the top of the cans to see if I could bring it down a bit.  It's important
to compare a new bulb to the existing ones at this point because the
darkening is hard to notice without a new bulb to make the comparison.  If I
found problems, in the worst case scenario I'd put a 12VDC cooling fan at
the point with the highest temperature and see if I could vent the output to
a cooler area.  However, you should be able to generate enough airflow by
convection that you won't need a fan.

> > I have kept all my packaging and receipts, but have not sent or returned
> > any
> > bulbs in a long time since I wanted to keep the bulbs for failure
analysis
> > and eventual recycling.
>
> Yeah, I keep stuff like that, too.  Too much the engineer -"now why did
that
> fail the way it did???"

After my first Lights of America (made in China!) CFL bulbs failed I
realized that the longevity was not going to match the package claims, so I
began keeping records, receipts, saved bulbs and an ever-lengthening list of
"not quite plug compatible" discrepancies, the worst of which is  "won't
work without a neutral at the switch with X-10."

> > > But if my X-10 is going to get swamped over time, them I have lost.
Do
> > > you  also see this with the N:Vision CFLSs?
>
> > My main gripes with N:Vision consist mostly of the flashing of the
lights
> > after they've been turned out by X-10.
> > ...
> > The N:Vision bulbs represent a substantial leap in usability and
> > reliability, particularly in an X-10 environment and I am thankful that
a
> > fellow CHA'er pointed them out to me.  But they're still a long way from
> > being the functional equivalent of an incandescent bulb.  I suspect
> > because of the basic design, they'll never reach parity with tungsten
bulbs in
> > areas like watts per cubic inch of lightbulb, steady light output
throughout the
> > entire life cycle, resistance to high temperatures and ecological
safety.
>
> Yeah, the more I study this, the more I agree with you.  It will likely
not
> be possible to make a fully plug-compatible replaclement CFL for a
tungsten.
> We just gotta figure out what featuers are imptorant and find the ones
that
> meet those requirements.

It's a reminder that this great country was built on a spirit of compromise.
Every day I've got to compromise something, somewhere!  It's time to
compromise and buy another batch of plug-in X-10 filters.

> I'll try to call N:Vision and give them the feedback.

Good idea.  X-10 users are probably not big on their list but I'll bet with
a little wheel squeaking we can move up.

> > They'll probably eliminate the need for having a neutral at each switch
> > box on the same day I complete my house rewiring to provide neutrals to
each
> > switch. )-:

> Oh, isn't that the truth!

Well, the project's going slowly enough to give them time to figure it out.
There's no end of fun running romex through old wood, brick, plaster and
lathe.

--
Bobby G.