Re: An ethical conundrum... Opinions welcome!

[Jim <alarminex@xxxxxxx>]

On Dec 5, 9:49=EF=BF=BDam, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> On Dec 4, 9:29=EF=BF=BDpm, Jim <alarmi...@xxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Dec 4, 7:11 pm, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > > On Dec 4, 6:47 pm, Frank Olson
>
> > > <use_the_email_li...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > JoeRaisin wrote:
> > > > > Frank Olson wrote:
> > > > >> tourman wrote:
> > > > >>> On Nov 29, 10:23 am, mleuck <m.le...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > >>>> On Nov 29, 3:11 am, Effenpig1 <dirtyspicev...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wro=
te:
>
> > > > >>>>>>> I've noticed a lot of high volume companies don't use timer=
 tests
> > > > >>>>>>> on residential systems, usually because they want to cut do=
wn on
> > > > >>>>>>> service since they don't have anyone local.
> > > > >>>>>> Yea right
> > > > >>>>> Ummm, Yea right, WHAT????
> > > > >>>> Ummm Yea right it's nonsense someone does not use timer tests =
to
> > > > >>>> prevent service calls.
>
> > > > >>> RHC: More likely they don't use test signals to cut down the nu=
mber of
> > > > >>> signals going in to their massive stations. Millions of account=
s
> > > > >>> equals millions of test signals, which in turn equals a lot mor=
e
> > > > >>> hardware to handle them. And if they can fall back on that
> > > > >>> manufacturer published doctrine..."test systems weekly" as an e=
xcuse
> > > > >>> not to do the right thing...why not ?
>
> > > > >>> To their way of corporate thinking, this might well make sense.=
....
> > > > >>> who knows what's in their minds !!! It would be interesting to =
know if
> > > > >>> the worst of the bunch...Alarmforce.... program in test
> > > > >>> signals...anyone know ?
>
> > > > >> I have no idea. I was talking to the manager of one of the bette=
r
> > > > >> alarmco's in Vancouver and he told me that they lost a client to
> > > > >> Alarmfarce. The guy had a full perimeter system installed.
> > > > >> Glass-break detectors, etc. Sold the house and the new owner mov=
ed
> > > > >> his Alarmfarce system in. One door, one PIR (made "pet proof" by
> > > > >> mounting it upside down three feet from the floor). The alarmco'=
s
> > > > >> service dept was contacted to power down their equipment (includ=
ing
> > > > >> the monitored smoke and carbon monoxide detectors). This company
> > > > >> charged $35.00 per month for monitoring ($25.00 per month for ba=
sic
> > > > >> service, $5.00 for fire, and $5.00 for CO). Alarmfarce charges $=
25.00
> > > > >> for their voice service. I suppose the customer perceived "value=
" in
> > > > >> one over the other. There's a lot of "hype" in the sales pitch u=
sed
> > > > >> by Alarmfarce. I hope Joel Matlin sleeps well at night secure in=
 the
> > > > >> knowledge that the fire and CO detectors in this house have been
> > > > >> neutralized because this customer chose "the best alarm system i=
n
> > > > >> North America".
>
> > > > >> PS. Like any good reputable alarm dealer the customer was offere=
d a
> > > > >> degraded system (local only) rather than disconnect the thing
> > > > >> entirely. He didn't want to pay for the service call so now, he =
has
> > > > >> practically "nothing".
>
> > > > > Good Freakin' God - I hope there are other smoke detectors in the=
 house.
>
> > > > > What is the liability - even if asked to do so - in killing smoke
> > > > > detectors in a house? Should the AHJ that granted occupancy way b=
ack
> > > > > when be contacted?
>
> > > > I have no idea (if there are 110VAC smokes on the premises). The AH=
J
> > > > isn't involved when system smoke alarms are added to a residential
> > > > security system. There isn't even a requirement to have them proper=
ly
> > > > supervised.
>
> > > > I know where you're coming from. Unfortunately there are still peop=
le
> > > > that don't properly research their options, and some people that ar=
e so
> > > > "stuck" on one particular product (or the hype surrounding it), tha=
t it
> > > > clearly affects their purchase decisions. God help all stupid peopl=
e
> > > > (stuck with Alarmfarce systems).
>
> > > RHC: Gawd, the utter stupidity of that homeowner is almost
> > > unbelievable. I know that people get well sold on the Alarmforce
> > > "hype" but that is going TOTALLY backwards !!!!!!!
> > > I guess Rube Goldstein had it right....there's a sucker born every
> > > minute.
>
> > I though that was PT Barnum
>
> > > Who said that a fool and his money are soon parted....WAIT ! I
> > > know...it was Joel Matlin....:))-
>
> > Or every Freebee alarm company customer.
>
> > But, if you think about it, both sayings basically say the same thing.
>
> RHC: Yeah, my mistake...it was PT Barnum. However, being serious for a
> moment, you will likely see these borderline scammers coming south
> soon. Frank (and I) are not exaggerating when we call them a "farce".
> Cheap, plug in all in one keypad made in Korea now I believe (they
> used to use Linear), totally wireless door and a wireless motion, non
> supervised wireless, for $25 a month, no contract, with little to no
> service available. If you want a medical remote (called Alarmcare),
> you pay $28 monthly. They spend millions on TV advertising peddling
> their two way voice and the fact that all other alarms are totally
> useless compared to their's. Their advertising agency is GOOD, and if
> I didn't know different, they could almost sell me. Their clients are
> absolutely sold on their systems, and will defend their choice to a
> point that is not logical....amazing !! A quick check at the local BBB
> tells a sad story for anyone investigating them; however, anyone
> inclined to get sucked in to their pitch is not likely the kind of
> person who checks things out in advance anyway.
>
> Freebee alarm companies at least give the client something real for
> the money in most cases. These people don't even do that.......-

I know what you are saying and feeling but .....
Getting riled about it isn't going to stop it. As heartless as it
sounds ..... I'm really not concerned about them or the people that
buy into what companies like that say or do. When all this "Freebee"
stuff started, I was just as concerned about what they'd do to my
business but after awhile I saw that it had no negative affect at all.
Let the Flim flam companies do what they will. Let the suckers do what
they will. They'd never listen to you in the first place and they'd
never be your customer. Maybe someday down the road they will be, but
not today. I do realize that it may be easier for me to say that than
someone who hasn't got as well an established customer base as I do
but you should be able to see from your own example. Even though you
started 30 years later than I did, you've been able to create an
established customer base that values your work ethic. Your customers
were smart enough to want more and saw through the ruse. And that's
exactly the kind of people you want as customers. Not the bargin
hunters, the ones who are always crying about how much it costs or
always looking for something free and are stupid enough to believe
they're getting it for free. You can't feel sorry for them and ......
If you really stretch your imagination a long, long way ......in a
way, you can't blame the companies who sell to them.

You know what they say ......... all men are created equal.
However, after they're created, there are no guarantees about equality
from that point forward.

Also, there's an old Pensylvania Dutch saying that's says something
like " To soon we grow old. To late we grow smart."
Some people never learn.