Re: Far Side Chat -- Fire Alarm Code Issue

["Norm Mugford" <1alarm@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Mr. Bass said:

"Needless to say, your experience and mine are from different locations".

I would agree Mr. Bass...so get your head out of your ass.

Norm Mugford




"Robert L. Bass" <robertlbass@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:bZ6dnXni6Ypu4-3fRVn-hA@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> "Frank Olson" <feolson@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:w2Zbe.1144576$Xk.1101033@xxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > "Robert L. Bass" <robertlbass@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > news:pdGdnciQHMs6z-3fRVn-sw@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>> In my experience the alarm wiring is
> >>> rarely questioned or even looked at.
> >>
> >> Needless to say, your experience and mine are from different locations.
> >> It should come as no surprise that we differ.
> >>
> >>> It falls into the same category as Cat 5,
> >>> telephone, and TV cable wiring...
> >>
> >> All of which are supposed to be permitted, inspected and approved (or
> >> not) where I worked.
> >>
> >>> All "low priority" stuff.  What the inspector
> >>> looks for is proper placement of the 110VAC
> >>> smoke alarms and that's about as far as he
> >>> goes with anything to do with "alarms".
> >>
> >> In most town is CT any current carrying conductors, even including coax
> >> antenna leads were subject to inspection by the AHJ.  Some towns were
> >> stricter than others.  Some places didn't care about anything carrying
> >> less than 50 Volts.  Others required a permit and inspection for every
> >> piece of copper you installed -- hint: more permit fees.  :^)
> >>
> >>> Inspectors here don't even inquire what the
> >>> alarm wiring's for.  We run 18-5 fire cable to
> >>> the smoke alarm locations on every pre-wire...
> >>
> >> Presumably you leave the 18-gauge outside the octo-boxes until you're
> >> ready to do the takeover, yes?
> >
> > Nope.   They're tagged "for alarm system use only".
>
> Do you wait until the 110 VAC cables are removed from the breaker panel
> before inserting the low voltage cables into the boxes?
>
> >>> then, when the homeowner elects to install
> >>> his security system we can replace the
> >>> 110VAC units with supervised 12VDC
> >>> photo-electric ones if the customer so desires.
> >>> This, of course is done with the "blessing" of
> >>> the AHJ, but even if we didn't have it, I
> >>> seriously doubt any would complain as what
> >>> we're providing far exceeds the 110V "cheapies".
> >>
> >> I brought that up with an inspector once when the client only wanted
one
> >> system smoke in an older home.  The inspector insisted that if we put
in
> >> a single smoke we must install the whole kit and caboodle per NFPA
> >> standards.
> >
> > The inspector has a valid point.
>
> Agreed.  Fortunately, the code has recently recognized the predicament
this
> creates for some owners of existing homes wanting to upgrade protection
but
> unable to afford a full-blown fire alarm system.  They are finally being
> allowed to add partial system protection where a system is not mandatory,
> such as existing structures or places where interconnected 110 VAC smokes
> are already in place.
>
> >> The homeowner declined any smoke protection at all rather than pay for
a
> >> major project.  That particular inspector also had a habit of refusing
to
> >> accept fire/burg combo panels on residences.  He said that he was
worried
> >> the homeowner might decide to take the panel with him when he sells,
> >> leaving the smokes inoperable.  That was Windsor, CT.  There was
nothing
> >> we could do but install a separate, small FACP next to the burglar
alarm
> >> control panel.
> >
> > Hmmm...  I thought the "homeowner declined".
>
> Sorry, I wasn't being clear.  The last sentence referred to other clients
in
> that town.  The first was an existing home with 110VAC smokes.  In that
case
> he did decline.  In other (mainly new construction) jobs in Windsor we had
> to install separate panels.
>
> The situation was all the more frustrating because there were two
inspectors
> in Windsor and only one refused to sign off on a combined system.  You
never
> knew in advance which one was going to inspect the job.
>
> --
>
> Regards,
> Robert L Bass
>
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