Re: Do these exist: "Instant on" or very rapid start CFL???

[Smarty <nobody@xxxxxxxxxx>]

On 6/8/2011 10:34 PM, Robert Green wrote:
> "Smarty"<nobody@xxxxxxxxxx>  wrote in message
> news:ismi6a$h2n$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> On 6/7/2011 1:29 PM, mkirsch1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
>>> On Jun 6, 9:58 pm, Smarty<nob...@xxxxxxxxxx>   wrote:
>>>> Is there such a thing as a true "instant start" CFL which produces full
>>>> intensity brightness as soon as it is turned on? I am trying to find an
>>>> indoor bulb which will not require any warm up period to attain full
>>>> brightness.
>>> So what kind of cockamaime, contrived logic is behind this
>>> requirement?
>>>
>>> The reason I ask is to not necessarily be hurtful, but to see if
>>> perhaps there is some other solution to your problem. People come in
>>> this newsgroup on a regular basis asking for some piece of Rube
>>> Goldberg unconventional uninvented technology to solve a problem that
>>> a different piece of common technology would solve with a lot less
>>> hassle.
>> As I posted earlier in this thread, my question arises from my attempt
>> to provide bright hallway and staircase access for elderly people with
>> diminished eyesight. The original 100 watt incandescent bulbs are only
>> switched on briefly, and CFLs take too long to get adequately bright.
>>
>> As it turns out, the recommendation from "Mal" was 100% correct. I went
>> to Lowes today, found the recently introduced General Electric "hybrid
>> technology" bulbs he described, and took some home for testing.
>>
>> They work superbly well.
>>
>> The two part hybrid design automatically turns on both the CFL and
>> halogen filament to provide full intensity output upon start-up. As the
>> CFL warms up, the halogen bulb is extinguished, and within maybe a
>> minute or so the lamp is 100% CFL.
>>
>> There is a small color shift as the color temperature shifts from warmer
>> (approx 2500 degrees Kelvin) to a cooler, bluer CFL temperature as the
>> halogen lamp is replaced by the CFL output. The effect is not something
>> you would normally see unless you are looking for it.
>>
>> The 75 watt equivalent version of the bulb consumes 20 watts, produces
>> over 1200 lumens output, is warrantied for 5 years for free replacement,
>> and is estimated to last for 7.3 years in average service. They are sold
>> at Lowes for $13 for two bulbs.
>>
>> This is an ideal solution for me, saving a lot of watts, maintaining
>> true "instant on", and having (supposedly) a long, warrantied life
>> expectancy.
>>
>> The nearest LED equivalent at Lowes was being offered on "clearance" for
>> $29 for 1 bulb. Much longer predicted life but considerably lower
>> lumens, 840 to be exact.
>>
>> I am extremely impressed with this new, dual hybrid design from a
>> lighting performance point of view. Time will tell if their MTBF /
>> failure / life expectancy prediction holds.
>>
>> I personally trust that GE will stand behind their warranty and are
>> unlikely to be exaggerating their claims. On the other hand, I have
>> several examples of "instant on" CFLs from Sylvania, Phillips, etc.
>> which are not in any way delivering anywhere near full output until
>> literally a minute or two after they are switched on. This GE is in a
>> class by itself.
>>
>> Thanks again to all who responded. As always, the knowledge and talent
>> on this forum is incredible and very much appreciated.
> That's great news.  I am about to order one from Amazon to see how they
> interact with my X-10 home automation system.  CFL bulbs have been a serious
> problem for X-10 users because their electronic profile is so different from
> tungsten incandescent bulbs, the kind X-10 was designed around.  Of course,
> Amazon's price is double that of Lowe's, but it might be weeks before I got
> up that way and I wanted to see how X-10 controller modules reacted to the
> lightbulb.
>
> I'm hoping these will eliminate the terrible problem of CFL's turning
> themselves back on because of how they work with the slight current trickle
> used in X-10 circuits to sense local control of the switch.  I've got my
> fingers crossed.  It could be the miracle bulb for both of us!
>
> --
> Bobby G.
>
>
Bobby,

I had a very elaborate X-10 set-up in my home, with many devices being
controlled by remote switches, and most of the lighting controlled by
both the dimmable and non-dimmable wall switches. I had a couple dozen
devices in total, and a bridge to ensure that both of my 110 volt feeds
were coupled to pass the comparatively weak control signals from some
home branch circuits to another. The system worked pretty reliably for
many years.

Once I switched to CFLs as well as standard fluorescent tubes, my X-10
system became totally unreliable with all sorts of false triggers.
Putting a scope on my AC line made it instantly obvious that the EMI
created by these lighting devices was much stronger than the X-10
signals. Furthermore, the X-10 code length was too short to ensure no
false triggering, given the noise environment.

I disconnected all of my X-10 stuff but have considered going to a newer
Zigby or other RF controlled local are net approach with supervised
switches capable of reporting their status back to the controller. I
have had terrible luck with any AC carrier line devices, including some
CCTV video cameras from Logitech and other devices which try to
piggy-back on the AC lines once I went to CFLs and flouresents.

The noise levels are just overwhelming for these sensitive carrier
devices like X-10. And the signaling was never designed to be robust
enough to cope with the noisy channel either. They would need to do
longer codes sent more redundantly to get anywhere near acceptable behavior.