Re: X10 still around?

["Solo Rider" <none@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

"Robert Green" <ROBERT_GREEN1963@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:h8GdncVH1c0OEK3eRVn-qg@xxxxxxxxxx
> "Marc F Hult" <MFHult@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:ecc0j19fiv85nu1n3g3r4p1pjpnvob3n7m@xxxxxxxxxx
>> On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:34:46 -0400, "Robert Green"
>> <ROBERT_GREEN1963@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>> <RaOdnSFgAOJE9LLeRVn-2w@xxxxxxx>:
>>
>> On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 00:51:10 GMT, Marc F Hult
>> <MFHult@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>> <8v2si15jbjkunvlbpem78a4m29cl1p68is@xxxxxxx>:
>>
>> >> -- What is their efficiency ?
>> >
>> >An interesting question.  I wonder if HA really contributes to lowering
>> >the national energy consumption in any significant way?  Most of the
>> >existing HA technologies have a pretty serious "standby" current
>> >consumption that has to be considered.  In the next iteration of HA, I
>> >am going to try to lower the standby power consumption at least 50%.
>> >If Zigbee arrives it time, it could be a big help since its design
>> >addresses standby power consumption.
>>
>>
>> I once did a calculation of how many power plants could be 'eliminated'
>> (hypothetically) if we just all reverted to 100% efficient wall switches
>> from dimmers with their inherent semiconductor band-gap losses. Gave
>> pause for thought.
>
> It wasn't until I was involved with spec'ing green PCs for some very large
> organizations that the savings became meaningful to me.  The difference
> between a 60W PC and a 150W one really add up when you get into the tens
> of
> thousands.  The differences between machines that put their components
> into
> standby mode and those that don't are also profound.  Ecologists are quick
> to point out that the standby consumption of electricity in the average
> home
> and workplace has been steadily on the rise, but so have the capabilities.
> Manual typewriters drew no standby current, but that's no reason to
> embrace
> them!
>
>> Progressive energy policy in this country has been set back by the
>> current administration. The change in the proposed January 2006
>> reduction in EER for new air conditioning from 16 to 15 EER is but one
>> small example of attack by a thousand knives.
>
> We're oil addicts and the current administration seems to think that
> Alaska
> is the ultimate big fix for trouble that has been brewing for over 50
> years.
> The upside of this $3 a gallon gas is that it's going to improve the solar
> payback equation and maybe even get solar into play in a big way.
>
>> Stubborn, ill-informed resistance to change like them folks what are
>> jist plain agin compact fluorescent because of what maybe usta kinda  be
>> is an example where 'we' are part of the problem.
>
> CF's have their place, yet there are places where I'd rather not use them
> and, in fact, it pays NOT to use them because they fail prematurely if
> cycled too often, as in a bathroom light.  I credit CF's and HA with
> keeping
> my bill relatively the same, year to year, even though the price of power
> has skyrocketed.  Probably more credit has to go to the CF's though.
>
>> Of course recognizing the cost of what we do and completing an adequate
>> economic and environmental analysis is part of the responsiblity that we
>> typically abrogate to the home builder for whom paying in the short-term
>> fro  long-term efficiencies can negatively affect their bottom line.
>> Hence sprawl, inefficient design and a litany of societal woes
>> reinforced by short-term profit by a few at the expense of long term
>> benefit of society as a whole (Can we count the ways Katrina shined
>> light on this too?)
>
> Katrina's going to shine a light on bad environmental practices just the
> way
> the dustbowl did early in the last century.  Let's hope the Great
> Depression
> II doesn't follow Katrina and her siblings.  There's already a great
> upheaval of people, just like dustbowl caused.  Balloon mortgages are
> back,
> too.
>
>> There are many ways in which homes can be built to be more efficient,
>> self-aware and self-controlling. Why don't discussions in
>> comp.home.automation newsgroup more often include how computerized home
>> automation could address this?
>
> I think it's because the bloom is off the rose for many HA enthusiasts and
> now that they've built their systems, they have to spend all their time
> updating, rewiring and fussing with their systems.  That tends to turn
> newsgroups into help Q&A sessions, and not strategic planning ones.
>
> It doesn't mean those sorts of discussions *can't* happen here.  I'll be
> building either a new house or an addition soon, and I'd sure like to have
> a
> plan for automation that's affordable, effective and maintainable by at
> least one person other than me.  One thing I've learned from a number of
> folks here is to document everything.  It's a bear to do correctly, but
> once
> you get the hang of it, it gets easier and easier.
>
> I've become more and more inclined to examine what I really want an HA
> system to do for me.  I think your background in sensors leads you ask why
> a
> house can't be made more "self-aware."  It's a good question.  Ever since
> we
> discussed lightning and thunder detection I've been thinking of what a
> truly
> complete home "nervous system" should look like.  Recent weather events
> have
> led me to consider how to design those systems so they can run a long time
> from very little power - maybe indefinitely if there's enough sun.

I've done the X-10 based HA successfully, to the point where it worked
without a lot of tinkering.  (HAI rocks),   However, its not the right
answer for the long term.  The right answer is clearly hard wired ala
CentralLite or equivalent.  All the smarts in one place, minimal power
dissipation.  Cost are up front, not recurring.  The issue there is long
term parts supply.  Vendors go out of business, parts go obsolete, etc.
However, all in all we think it is the superior approach.

The house will be located in the high desert so solar power is very
desirable.  Looking at a mix of low voltage and AC or even all low voltage
with Solar/battery as primary with AC backup.  Have a year or two to figure
it out, but clearly HA and low voltage is going to be a hard fit.  Passive
solar for water heating is still be looked at for economic viability.
Anyone have any ideas for low voltage HA and where to get it.  Any
recommendations for solar water heating would be welcome too.