Re: Why Don't You Like DSC? (Addressed to those that don't.)

["Jim" <alarminex@xxxxxxx>]

Mark Leuck wrote:
> "Jim" <alarminex@xxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:1115870558.327412.4690@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
> > >
>
> Yes as you say follow the user manual, don't need it with a V15P or
DSC 1550
>
> And in my opinion most people don't change user codes

Well,  I didn't think it was that important either but you used it as
an example of how it was easier on other panels.
>
> > Now another story is ...... from NAPCO's point of view, if they are
as
> > hard to program as people seem to think they are, even if it's only
a
> > perception and not reality, it behooves Napco to attend to it. I've
> > taught some novice installers ( electricians with no experience
> > whatsoever) how to program Napco and it takes about a half hour, to
an
> > hour with a few follow up questions about some details. I'd guess
that
> > most people who perceive Napco is hard to program, probably tried
to do
> > it with  ..... either no, little or not good training.
>
> Its always the same story.


What is? Napco's need to attend to it or it only takes a short time or
the no training part?

>
> Tech can't get into programming unless they know which keypad is
address 1
> which ends up being time consuming to figure THAT out,

Well I guess if there were 7 keypads.......... but, I always make it
the keypad closest to the panel. Seems to make sense.

> then trying to
> explain how to keypad program

Way .... way ..... wait a minute!!!!! ....... have you been talking
about KEYPAD programing all this time? What kind of dummy is going to
hand program a 20 or 30 zone system by hand? If they do, they deserve
to run into and make as many mistakes as the can. How in the hell do
you check for errors? I haven't hand programed a direct downloadable
panel in so many years ....... I forget how long it's been. I can't
even remember the last time I looked in a programing manual, for that
matter.

So ........ then ......... rather than comparing hand programing, how
would you rate Napco compared to others with just downloading? Never
mind the banging together of two keypads to start a fire method.


>
> I won't attempt walking someone through keypad programming on a
Gem-P3200
> with the 2-digit low end keypad but I have no problems at all working
with
> the binary display on a low end LED keypad connected to a DSC panel.
Hands
> down the Napco panel is much more difficult and time consuming to do
even
> the most basic programming compared to anything else out there. I
could see
> the complexity back in the MA2600/3000 era but in this day and age it
is
> neither acceptable or required, everyone else has moved on to easier
> programming (check out an ITI/GE Concord sometime) and so should
Napco

Even if I did try out any other panel, I'd NEVER try to hand program
it. Why would anyone? That's like buying a car and pushing it wherever
you want to go.

>
>
> > I have very
> > little to compare to, but when I do have to program another panel,
it
> > only takes me a few minutes to figure it out. I assumed it was
because
> > Napco was so detailed and with so many options, compared to other
mfg's
> > and because I'd been doing Napco for so long.
>
> Could be since Napco is so complicated it makes everything else so
much
> easier :)

Now that I know you're talking about hand programing, I don't think
anything that I've said earlier applies.

>
> > Looking back to the beginning, it was just something that came easy
to
> > me in comparison to what Ademco was doing at the time. If it
didn't, I
> > would have likely sought another mfg. Go figure. Recently had to
return
> > a 9600, bad out of the box, but thats the first time in many years,
> > that I've had a problem. So there's no reason for me to consider
> > changing, simply because programing may be simpler on another make
of
> > panel. However it *has* to be an issue with Napco.
>
> Yup, many in this newsgroup don't seem to realize most techs program
via the
> keypad not downloader and I will not download a panel unless I know
how to
> keypad program it first

To each his own. Perhaps for what you do, that's what's necessary. But
it'd be a cold day in hell before I'd hand program any direct
downloadable panel.