Re: OT - DVD writers

["treloar_tech" <jasonjlee@xxxxxxx>]

pong!

Hi Mark!

> You're confusing different things here.

No, I got the concept. You've discussed 2 different systems. You've
put your case very clearly... From one of your posts..

>       > > I was over-simplifying about = the archive usage - the HDD
is question is,
>       > itself, backed up, to an Applicati= on Service Provider with
a full HSM
>       backup
>       > offering that does a full delta-bl= ock backup...

My point was Mark, that this one disk backup at work is not your only
backup of that data.

So I guess you don't trust 'just the one disk' system with anything
important. No, let me put that another way. I don't need to guess,
you've already told me you don't!

Now, my point is not budgets. My point is I wouldn't trust my work to
one backup on HD. I've done it. It failed.

I guess this is pong to your ping, but anyway, as I wrote, I can
accept your position is different to mine. Can you not accept
likewise?

J


--- In ukha_d@y..., "Mark Harrison" <Mark.Harrison@e...> wr= ote:
> Jason,
> 
> You're confusing different things here.
> 
> The "backup being done by ISP" is a "got a large corpor= ate budget
solution at work".
> 
> The "backup to another PC on the LAN" is my "home solut= ion."
> 
> M.
>
>       -----Original Message-----
>       From: Jason Lee [mailto:jasonjlee@n...]=
>       Sent: Sun 07/07/2002 14:01
>       To: ukha_d@y...
>       Cc:
>       Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Re: OT - DVD writ= ers
>      
>      
>
>       Mark,
>      
>       If you read thru my post I said I would= n't trust *the backup*
to a single
>       disk. As in, I have my hard disk, and h= ave a backup. That
backup should not
>       be a single hd in my opinion.
>      
>       I gave calc's on cheapness but that dep= ends on how much your
backing up and
>       when.
>      
>       I also gave the circumstances that, doi= ng exactly what you
suggested here, I
>       lost 2 weeks work. It was bad luck, but= it happened.
>      
>       Also, if you trust this method so much,= why do you have
another backup being
>       made by the ISP?
>      
>       So I think we can agree to disagree. At= least, I don't want
to ping-pong
>       this all day. I've got x10 wiring to le= arn about!
>      
>       J
>      
>      
>       ----- Original Message -----
>       From: "Mark Harrison" <Mar= k.Harrison@e...>
>       To: <ukha_d@y...>
>       Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2002 1:08 PM
>       Subject: RE: [ukha_d] Re: OT - DVD writ= ers
>      
>      
>       > Jason,
>       >
>       > But you're not trusting it to a si= ngle HD.... you're making
a BACKUP on a
>       different one... that's the point!
>       >
>       > I'm not disagreeing that DVD-write= rs have other benefits,
but if all
>       you're looking for is a backup, then th= ey aren't the cheapest
solution.
>       >
>       > The point about a backup is that i= t's an EXTRA copy... so
you don't have a
>       single point of failure anywhere.
>       >
>       > M.
>       >
>       > -----Original Message-----
>       > From: Jason Lee [mailto:jasonjlee@= n...]
>       > Sent: Sun 07/07/2002 00:32
>       > To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx >       > Cc:
>       > Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Re: OT - DVD= writers
>       >
>       >
>       >
>       > To me, anything that is important = enough to not lose, I
wouldn't trust the
>       > backup to a single hd.
>       >
>       > They fail.
>       >
>       > As they did when *TWO* 75Gig Ibms = died without warning,
taking 2 weeks of
>       > coding with it. (I was lucky I had= been backing up to the
dvd-ram before
>       > then). As your in IT I think you w= ill know the drives I am
referring too.
>       I
>       > had them just after launch when th= e great reviews were
around, before the
>       > faulty units started to appear. If= I remember correctly it
was something
>       to
>       > do with when they bought the Hunga= ry factory online. I
don't make the same
>       > mistake twice, so I won't trust HD= for backups again.
>       >
>       > Now HD space cheaper than dvd-r? >       >
>       > 89p for 4.3g DVD-RW
>       > Say 10 disks.. =C2=A38.90. 43gig..=
>       > Now you have to factor in the cost= of the dvd-r etc,etc,
but as I said
>       > before dvd writers have side benef= its.
>       > (But then in your example you fact= or in the pc which you
costed at =C2=A3200.)
>       >
>       > And you have to manage the media, = but thats not too bad.
>       >
>       > What I'm after is an affordable DV= D autoloader. If Yamaha
Japan would just
>       > reply to my emails..
>       >
>       > Anyway, I think we can agree to di= sagree. To each his own.
>       >
>       > J
>       >
>       > ----- Original Message -----
>       > From: "Mark Harrison" &l= t;Mark.Harrison@e...>
>       > To: <ukha_d@y...>
>       > Sent: Saturday, July 06, 2002 8:02= PM
>       > Subject: RE: [ukha_d] Re: OT - DVD= writers
>       >
>       >
>       > > Jason,
>       > >
>       > > As I said - "if your req= uirement is simply _backup_".
>       > >
>       > > I _am_ prepared to put _backu= ps_ on a non-RAID HDD...
because _backup_
>       > means "spare copy".
>       > >
>       > > I was over-simplifying about = the archive usage - the HDD
is question is,
>       > itself, backed up, to an Applicati= on Service Provider with
a full HSM
>       backup
>       > offering that does a full delta-bl= ock backup... I'm
guessing, however,
>       that
>       > this would be out of Ray's price r= ange if he's talking
about buying a
>       > DVD-writer :-)
>       > >
>       > > The point was that hard disk = space is, now, rather
cheaper than tape, or
>       > blank optical media... so if the s= olution really is a
_backup_, a copy to
>       > another PC is actually the cheapes= t way to go. I know that
a number of
>       > people on this group use _removabl= e_ IDE drives for this
purpose...
>       > >
>       > > Mark
>       > >
>       > > -----Original Message----- >       > > From: Jason Lee [mailto:jason= jlee@n...]
>       > > Sent: Sat 06/07/2002 11:49 >       > > To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx >       > > Cc:
>       > > Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Re: OT = - DVD writers
>       > >
>       > >
>       > >
>       > > Um, I would have said the sam= e thing before I experienced
IBM hard
>       drives
>       > a
>       > > while ago.
>       > >
>       > > As a cheap solution, yeah may= be. But Hard Disks fail..
>       > >
>       > > I bet you don't put any data = "you" couldn't live without on
that system at
>       > > work, unless its raided?
>       > >
>       > > Plus having a dvdwriter has s= ide benefits.
>       > >
>       > > The 'which disk is that on' I= am working on.. Once I've
got the projects
>       > > I've already started finished= !
>       > >
>       > > oh and double sided disks are= around for dvd-r.. not sure
of the quality
>       > > though.
>       > >
>       > > J
>       > >
>       > >
>       > > ----- Original Message -----<= BR> >       > > From: "mark_harrison_uk1= " <Mark.Harrison@e...>
>       > > To: <ukha_d@y...>
>       > > Sent: Saturday, July 06, 2002= 11:43 AM
>       > > Subject: [ukha_d] Re: OT - DV= D writers
>       > >
>       > >
>       > > Ray,
>       > >
>       > > If you requirement is simply = backup for that kind of data
volume,
>       > > there's a more cost-effective= , and fast solution than
either you
>       > > propose.
>       > >
>       > > A second PC (second-hand, a P= 2 would be fine), with a,
say, 60Gb HDD
>       > > in it, a couple of network ca= rds and a crossover cable -
and lo, your
>       > > ideal backup solution for abo= ut =C2=A3200.
>       > >
>       > > It's what I do at home for ba= ckup... it's also what we
now do at work
>       > > for long-term archiving of th= e digital images for the
comet website!
>       > > The cost equation of hardware= was about the same, but
once you took
>       > > into account the indexing pro= blem (which CD is that photo
on)... it
>       > > became an obvious thing to do= .
>       > >
>       > > Regards,
>       > >
>       > > Mark
>       > >
>       > >
>       > >
>       > >
>       > > --- In ukha_d@y..., "Ray= Barnett" <lists@t...> wrote:
>       > > > Hi,
>       > > >
>       > > > Just wanted a quick bit = of advice since I gather some
people here
>       > > use them a
>       > > > fair bit...
>       > > >
>       > > > I urgently need to imple= ment a backup system capable of
looking
>       > > after my
>       > > > rapidly growing 20GBs of= digital photos.
>       > > >
>       > > > Current favourites are a= DVD writer or an Onstream 60GB
tape thingy.
>       > > > However, I've just confu= sed myself over the
compatibilities of the
>       > > various
>       > > > DVD writers. Just how co= mpatible is a DVD-R writer, and
is it a
>       > > dead duck
>       > > > now that DVD+R is gettin= g more popular?
>       > > >
>       > > > Thanks,
>       > > >
>       > > > Ray Barnett.
>       > >
>       > >
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