Re: No more X10 at Radio Shack?

["Bill Kearney" <wkearney99@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

"Robert Green" <ROBERT_GREEN1963@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:mcmdnXsiarUfm_DYnZ2dnUVZ_uCdnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxx
> "Bill Kearney" <wkearney99@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>
> > When I sell the house the new owners don't even need to care about the
> > switches.  They're just like normal switches, requiring nothing special
> > about using them.
>
> But will you be able to recover the cost of your investment in RA?  I have
> my doubts.

My time and satisfaction is worth something.  The time/money wasted on X10
has no doubt been considerably more than the cost of RadioRA gear.  Like I
said, I'm not at all worried about recovering the costs.  I like how these
work, that makes it worth the expense.

> I also understand that there's a 32/64 device limit, well
> under the 256 that X-10 offers.

Yeah right, two hundred and fifty six pieces of shit that don't work is not
my idea of an advantage.  I dare you to get that many working in a residence
anyway.  The signal collisions would make it nearly impossible to use it
without driving your spouse insane.

Yeah, in theory I'd like more device addresses.  In practice, however, I've
found I don't need more.  Since I run all my gear through a PC I could just
add another RS232 interface and a repeater.  Not as "easy" as X10 but at
least I'd KNOW they'd work.

> More importantly, RF is *always* subject to interference.

Oh that's bullshit.  X10 is even WORSE for being susceptible to
interference.  I've got all sorts of RF polluting crap here at the house and
have NEVER, EVER had an interference problem with RadioRA.  Not once.  And
I've had plenty of RF issues with things IR-RF remote repeaters (besides the
shitty powermid abominations of course).

> I suppose you can
> Faradize your house to keep out EMI from some nearby government
transmitter
> but that would be a bitch.

This is a 50's era brick on block construction house in the DC metro area.
It's ALREADY a faraday cage.  Damn near kills cell phone coverage just by
walking indoors.  Outside RF is the LEAST of my worries!

> Easier to filter the powerline as it comes into
> the house than the entire radio spectrum as it pours through the walls.

Outside interference isn't what plagues most single homes with X10's crappy
protocol.  It's the other devices already inside the house that X10 can't
interoperate with.

> More importantly to me, X-10 is really a dual protocol, using both RF and
> PLC.  That gives me a fast fallback position if the local AF base begins
> transmitting a signal that ends up jamming the RF.  Not likely, but not
> impossible either.

X10's RF "sucks less" than their powerline crap, I'll give you that.  But
barring use of someone else's RF transceiver even that's a pain in the ass
to get working reliably.

> Yes.  It's all crap.  Anyone reading this should box all their X-10 stuff
up
> and sell it on Ebay before the bottom falls out completely.  Palmpads,
> Stickaswitches and their larger AAA powered cousins, appliance modules -
> sell them now before it's too late.  No reserve price either.  (But drop
me
> a line if you do!) (/sarcasm off)

Had I the patience to put up with shipping all the crap I'd sell 'em on
fleabay.  Meanwhile they're just gathering dust.  I really don't feel like
inflicting their pain on someone else.

> It all depends on your "use profile."  Obviously, for a lot of people,
X-10
> still does the job.  Thanks to Jeff V. and the XTB, the major problem I've
> suffered (weak PLC signal) has disappeared and now I am troubled more by
the
> rotten switch feeling of some of the switches.  Would I like something
> better?  Sure!  But there's the little problem of never being able to
> justify to my self or my wife any schema that involved a cost of over $100
a
> load.  Or even $50 a load.  Her attitude is that we have HA because *I* am
> too lazy to get up and turn off a light.  It's hard to advance that
position
> into one where we spend $1,000's on something that we'll never recover in
a
> sale.  For us, something like a granite countertop upgrade would be a much
> better long-term investment in so many ways than something like RadioRA. .
.

No doubt, the WAF always comes into play.  But for me it's a matter of
balancing between the wife absolutely DESPISING the crappy X10 switch-feel,
not to mention the complete lack of reliability, or the one time
unrecoverable costs.  Buck up, waste the money and avoid the complaints.

> But it's really a case of "to each his own."  Reliability is important to
> you.  Not breaking the budget is important to me.  Not putting lots of
money
> into a house we'll be selling soon is also important to me.  X-10 lets me
do
> a lot of things for very little money.  Not perfectly, but quite well
enough
> to suit my tastes.

I'm always boggled by the number of people that will go to such lengths to
defend the absolutely shitty performance of the X10 gear.  It JUST DOESN'T
WORK.  Sure, tweak it endlessly and don't add any new devices and you MAY be
able to get it stabilized.  It's not a matter of not being perfect, hell,
even I'd put up with some degree of issues.  But without having reliable
2-way or status tracking it's just impossible to get it all working in a
manner that doesn't constantly call attention to itself as being a
clusterfuck.  This is not conducive to garnering spousal respect.

Of course now with the recent news that Control4 is going to start pimping
their stuff through BestBuy it might be interesting to see how the price
points adjust again...

-Bill Kearney