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RE: Problem ceiling inspiration sought..
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Thanks. I have taken a scraper and a good degree of elbow grease to a large
section of it, and most of it came off with less argument than I
anticipated, although a few sections are really rock hard & stuck fast
- and
seems to be in a different material.. I have no doubt that I can (and will)
get those off too, perhaps with the aid of some electrickery.
I had wondered about the need to prop boards up for a while if using glue.
most of that construction stuff isn't what I'd call instant grab - not in
the same way a contact adhesive is for example. and this is a good thing,
since there needs to be a little bit of wiggle possible to ensure a good
fit
of the tongue & groove. should I make some braces that I can wedge
underneath each board for a period of time after sticking to the ceiling? -
and how long ought to be sufficient before removing the prop (without the
board falling off of course!). - the time left in-situ dictates how many
props are required and in turn how many boards I can stick up per session.
TIA
Paul G.
From: ukha_d@xxxxxxx [mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 13 May 2015 18:51
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Problem ceiling inspiration sought..
You want to get rid of the ceiling coating, or at least get it flat. Either
an Artex remover such as X Tex or a powered sander and a bloody good
breathing mask.
A hi-grab construction adhesive (like No More Nails) will hold the boards
up
as long as the material underneath is sound.
Regards,
Steve
From: "Paul Gordon paul_gordon@xxxxxxx [ukha_d]"
<ukha_d@xxxxxxx>
Reply-To: <ukha_d@xxxxxxx>
Date: Saturday, 9 May 2015 12:25
To: <UK_Selfbuild@xxxxxxx>, UKHA Group <ukha_d@xxxxxxx>
Subject: [ukha_d] Problem ceiling inspiration sought..
Kinda related to the UKHA crowd since the room is going to be my home
cinema
/ man cave.
I have a problem ceiling that I need to deal with. the problem(s) are, in
the main:
1. It is already very low (2m) so I *REALLY* don't want to drop it
any
further than a few mm, so battening & adding an additional false
ceiling is
not really an option
2. It is solid concrete (basement room) so nailing is impossible, and
drilling/plugging/screwing would be an unimaginable amount of work, which I
*REALLY* don't want to get into (I already had to drill & screw a few
holes
in one of the other basement room ceilings, and just those few led to some
fairly fruity language! Not to mention the many ruined masonry drill bits,
and one actual electric hammer drill burned out)
3. It has been previously painted with some of that stipple paint
stuff, which goes on to a depth of around 1-2mm, however, a few fairly
large
areas of that have flaked off, leaving 1-2mm ridges round the edges of
those
areas. Although concentrated mainly in one part of the ceiling, they're in
the middle, and very visible. This means just painting with emulsion isn't
possible.
4. Most of the ceiling still has good adhesion with the stipple
paint,
so stripping all of it off the whole ceiling will be difficult. I've
already
taken a scraper to it & removed most, if not all, the stipple paint
that's
no long adhering properly, & working at the edges to get more of it off
is
quite difficult already.
5. I'm limited to treatments that are available in Norway! Plaster
ceilings are pretty much unheard of here, and so , therefore, are
plasterers.
I have a few ideas mulling around in my head.
1. I have used MDF ceiling boards elsewhere, these are 8mm thick, x
300mm wide x 1810mm long. According to the documentation, each board works
out at 3.2KG each, - which sounds a bit much to me, as when lifting these
boards, I've always thought they felt pretty light, nevertheless, the specs
on the website state they are 16KG per pack of 5 boards. I like the
finished
look of these boards and wouldn't mind using them in this room as well, but
as per problems 1 & 2, they cannot be fixed as per their design, which
is to
nail through the hidden tongue/groove into the ceiling behind. The only
fixing option available is to glue. anyone have any idea how feasible this
could be?... it must be *possible* since some sports cars are glued
together, and that must be under more stress forces than the gravity trying
to pull boards off my ceiling. being bare MDF on the back, a very wet glue
isn't wise. but what would be? Normal gun-able construction adhesive? A
contact adhesive? - as the existing surface is slightly textured from the
stipple paint, it would have to be a gap-filling capable product. I have
just so many doubts about the wisdom of trying this.
2. I could smooth out, as much as possible, the ridges around the
edges of the flaked away areas with normal interior filler, to make the
transitions much more gradual, then paper over the whole ceiling with some
'repair' type paper designed to smooth out poor surfaces. Then I could
emulsion over the top. This has the advantage of adding virtually no extra
thickness to the ceiling so not reducing the height any further.
3. I could attempt to re-do the stipple paint type surface, using a
product that will go on sufficiently thick to cover over all the flaked
areas (I could pre-fill the edges as well just for good measure)
4. I can try to find a plasterer here in Norway and have the entire
ceiling skimmed to a nice smooth, flat finish, then emulsion over the lot.
(but plasterers are rarer than rocking horse doo-doo here)
5. Fixing lightweight ceiling tiles, such as polystyrene (ugh!) or
some such. not readily available in any of the DIY sheds here, no idea if
there is in fact anywhere in Norway that can supply these locally.. may be
a
non-starter..
Just setting out all these options in this list has helped clarify my
thought process somewhat, to the degree that I'm currently leaning towards
solution number 2, but I'd certainly appreciate any & all thoughts,
suggestions, product recommendations, or any ideas - no matter how zany -
that I may not have considered.
Have at it folks! - what do you reckon?
Cheers.
Paul G.
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<div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'>Thanks… I have taken a scraper and a
good degree of elbow grease to a large section of it, and most of it came
off with less argument than I anticipated, although a few sections are
really rock hard & stuck fast – and seems to be in a
different material.. I have no doubt that I can (and will) get those off
too, perhaps with the aid of some
electrickery…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>I had wondered about
the need to prop boards up for a while if using glue… most of
that construction stuff isn’t what I’d call instant
grab – not in the same way a contact adhesive is for
example… and this is a good thing, since there needs to be a
little bit of wiggle p
ossible to ensure a good fit of the tongue & groove…
should I make some braces that I can wedge
underneath each board for a period of time after sticking to the ceiling?
– and how long ought to be sufficient before removing the prop
(without the board falling off of course!). – the time left
in-situ dictates how many props are required and in turn how many boards I
can stick up per
session…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'>TIA<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>Paul
G.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> <
;/o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div
style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm
0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='fon
t-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'>From:</span></b><span
lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'>
ukha_d@xxxxxxx [mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx]
<br><b>Sent:</b> 13 May 2015
18:51<br><b>To:</b>
ukha_d@xxxxxxx<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [ukha_d] Problem
ceiling inspiration
sought..<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p
class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'>You
want to get rid of the ceiling coating, or at least get it flat. Either an
Artex remover such as X Tex or a pow
ered sander and a bloody good breathing
mask.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'>A
hi-grab con
struction adhesive (like No More Nails) will hold the boards up as long as
the material underneath is
sound.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'>Steve<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div
style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm
0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span
style='color:black'>From: </span></b><span
style='color:black'>"Paul Gordon <a href=&qu
ot;mailto:paul_gordon@xxxxxxx";>paul_gordon@xxxxxxx</a>
[ukha_d]" <<a href="mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx";>ukha_d@xxxxxxx</a>><br><b>Reply-To:
</b><<a href="mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx";>ukha_d@xxxxxxx</a>><br><b>Date:
</b>Saturday, 9 May 2015 12:25<br><b>To:
</b><<a href="mailto:UK_Selfbuild@xxxxxxx";>UK_Selfbuild@xxxxxxx</a>>,
UKHA Group <<a href="mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx";>ukha_d@xxxxxxx</a>><br><b>Subject:
</b>[ukha_d] Problem ceiling inspiration
sought..<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Kinda related to the
UKHA crowd since the room is going to be my home cinema / man
cave…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>&
lt;p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>I have a problem
ceiling that I need to deal with… the problem(s) are, in the
main:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span st
yle='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>It is already very low (2m) so I
*<b>REALLY</b>* don’t want to drop it any further
than a few mm, so battening & adding an additional false ceiling is
not really an option<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>It is solid concrete (basement room) so nailing is
impossible, and drilling/plugging/screwing would be an unimaginable am
ount of work, which I *<b>REALLY</b>* don’t want to
get into (I already had to drill & screw a few holes in one of the
other basement room ceilings, and just those few led to some fa
irly fruity language! Not to mention the many ruined masonry drill bits,
and one actual electric hammer drill burned
out)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>3.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>It has been previously painted with some of that
stipple paint stuff, which goes on to a depth of around 1-2mm, however, a
few fairly large areas of that have flaked off, leaving 1-2mm ridges round
the edges of those areas. Although concentrated mainly in one part of the
ceiling, they’re in the middle, and very visible… This
means just painting with emulsion isn’t
possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=Mso
ListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-li
st:Ignore'>4.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>Most of the ceiling still has good adhesion with the
stipple paint, so stripping all of it off the whole ceiling will be
difficult. I’ve already taken a scraper to it & removed
most, if not all, the stipple paint that’s no long adhering
properly, & working at the edges to get more of it off is quite
difficult already.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>5.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>I̵
7;m limited to treatments that are available in Norway! Plaster ceilings
are pretty much unheard of here, and so , therefore, are
plasterers…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNorma
l><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>I have a few ideas
mulling around in my
head…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l2 level1
lfo4'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>I have used MDF ceiling boards elsewhere, these are
8mm thick, x 300mm wide x 1810mm long. According to the documentation, each
board works out at 3.2KG each
, - which sounds a bit much to me, as when lifting these boards,
I’ve always thought they felt pretty light, nevertheless, the
specs on the website state they are 16KG per pack of 5 boards… I
like the finished look
of these boards and wouldn’t mind using them in this room as
well, but as per problems 1 & 2, they cannot be fixed as per their
design, which is to nail through the hidden tongue/groove into the ceiling
behind. The only fixing option available is to glue… anyone have
any idea how feasible this could be?... it must be
*<b>possible</b>* since some sports cars are glued together,
and that must be under more stress forces than the gravity trying to pull
boards off my ceiling… being bare MDF on the back, a very wet
glue isn’t wise… but what would be? Normal gun-able
construction adhesive? A contact adhesive? – as the existing
surface is slightly textured from the stipple paint, it would have to be a
gap-filling capable product… I have just so many doubts about the
wisdom of trying
this…<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0
pt;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:
black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.<span style='font:7.0pt
"Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>I could smooth out, as much as possible, the ridges
around the edges of the flaked away areas with normal interior filler, to
make the transitions much more gradual, then paper over the whole ceiling
with some ‘repair’ type paper designed to smooth out
poor surfaces. Then I could emulsion over the top. This has the advantage
of adding virtually no extra thickness to the ceiling so not reducing the
height any
further.<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l2 level1
lfo4'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>3.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> &
amp;nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>I could attempt to re-do the stipple paint type
surface, usin
g a product that will go on sufficiently thick to cover over all the flaked
areas (I could pre-fill the edges as well just for good
measure)<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l2 level1
lfo4'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>4.<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>I can try to find a plasterer here in Norway and
have the entire ceiling skimmed to a nice smooth, flat finish, then
emulsion over the lot. (but plasterers are rarer than rocking horse doo-doo
here)<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l2 level1
lfo4'><![if !supportLists]><span style='color:black'>&
lt;span style='mso-list:Ignore'>5.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times
New
Roman"'>
</span></span></span><![endif]><span
style='color:black'>Fix
ing lightweight ceiling tiles, such as polystyrene (ugh!) or some
such… not readily available in any of the DIY sheds here, no idea
if there is in fact anywhere in Norway that can supply these locally.. may
be a non-starter..<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Just setting out all
these options in this list has helped clarify my thought process somewhat,
to the degree that I’m currently leaning towards solution number
2, but I’d certainly appreciate any & all thoughts,
suggestions, product recommendations, or any ideas – no matter
how zany – that I may not have
considered…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span st
yle='color:black'>Have at it folks! – what do you
reckon?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></spa
n></p><p class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'>Cheers.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Paul
G.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:18.0pt'><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.5pt;color:white;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div>
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