Re: Electric Lock choice

["Jackcsg" <nospam@xxxxxxxxxx>]

"J. Sloud" <jsloud@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:gmmqe1ddsifn8jhgb8h0o8qld0nj22jr9i@xxxxxxxxxx
> On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 18:44:45 -0400, "Jackcsg" <nospam@xxxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
>
> Jack,
>
> My point was to caution the original poster about improper use of
> mags.  I know you know your stuff, but we see it all the time, and I
> get a little pissed off when I see a potentially life-threatening
> situation.  I've also seen too many instances where power been lost to
> a maglock and critical doors are left to flap open in the breeze.
> I've also watched a smart-ass engineer slide a pice of paper through a
> crack between the door and frame to activate a Rex motion and open a
> mag.  We install a lot of mags, but we're careful where they go and
> what their limitations are.  Same with strikes.  I've seen those
> mounted on the unsecured side, open to tampering, way too many times
> as well.  I've seen customers bypass them with a key.  Of course a
> good IDS with DPS at least lets you know when the doors been
> compromised.

I hear ya'. I have yet to even come accross one, in combination with a
system, installed correctly. Knowing the door status is key. Knowing
security is even more important. REX motions have their place....I think
I've installed about 5 in the last 20 years, most of which just to shunt a
door contact, rather than release a lock. Some people just feel safer
installing door strikes, and their attributes than providing access control.
Each has it's place.

> >
> >Yeah, then tell me the Government follows NFPA101 in that instance?
They're
> >all just guidelines.
>
> They actually insisted on it in their specs since this facility serves
> the general public (airport). The maglocks are a Locknetics UL models
> with a built in sounder/ timer that automatically releases after 15
> seconds of someone pushing on the door:
>
http://www.locknetics.com/pdf/Delayed%20Egress%20and%20Sensor%20Locks%20.pdf
> see page F17 of above for the relevant code section if you're
> interested.

The US Holocaust building has them all over the place. I used to change out
2 or three a year do to failures. Their junk IMO, and I would never delay
egress for any reason. But hey, where would we all be without some wonderful
engineers sitting behind a desk.

>
> >Relax J, I know well enough you're capable of understanding the
> >circumstance(s). I was a little hot from your blanket statement about
> >Maglocks. I wasn't trying to start a war over this issue, just voicing my
> >opinion. If you can't control keys, you have no access control. I wish it
> >were as simple as eliminating the fears of Maglocks, verses installing a
> >strike to be safe (or free from liability), but a strike offers no audit
> >trail for controlling access. Magnetic locks are very safe when installed
> >correctly.
> >P.S. I liked the "cut the power to the building and wait".....bit....
> >
>
> With a door strike, you are assuming that the door lever set can be
> operated with a key.  Eliminate the operability with the key, and you
> fix the strike issue.   Maglocks just seem to have more potential
> issues.  Of course, we have many doors with in and out readers, and in
> those instances, door strikes have the same (if not worse)  life
> safety issues as mags since there is no free egress.

I can't off hand think of any issues I've ever encountered with a Maglock
I've installed, but I've heard some good stories from a few AHJ's over the
years on how people install them incorrectly.
FYI. Next time you look at an install, a maglock, look at the STI 2400 Pull
Station. It is DPDT with one contact NC for the lock power, and one side NO.
Tie in the NO side to a zone, and actually monitor the disconnect for
supervision. Since I've been using this device, I have not had one single
issue, or dance with an AHJ. And it works everytime, under any circumstance.
Something to consider....