Re: XTB, reliablity, etc.

["Robert Green" <ROBERT_GREEN1963@xxxxxxxxx>]

"Marc_F_Hult" <MFHult@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message

<stuff snipped>

> Take the example of converting to centralized hard-wired
> dimming of a ceiling light powered through a wall switch.

That ceiling light represents perhaps one tenth of my HA use.  Most of my
modules are plugged into outlets or powerstrips controlling free-standing
lamps and devices.  When you have to start pulling wire to every switch and
outlet in the house to create a truly hardwired control system, you're
talking about turning the house upside.  Wifey no like!

> Commonly you
> can get to the supply to that individual switch where it comes up the
> wall from the basement. Retrofitting for a centralized hardwired system
> consists in replacing the SPST switch with a wirenut, replacing the
> faceplate with the hole with one with no hole, and running a 14/2+G to
> the dimmer panel through the basement ceiling. How hard is that?

See my response to Brian about how hard that can be.  I stand by what I said
to him.  Running a new three-way switch - just a manual version - takes a
heck of lot more time and effort than doing it via X-10, at least for me.
Why?  Well I have the proper tools.  Meters and filters.  Without the right
tools any project becomes difficult.  Try fishing wire without fish tapes
and long drill bits.  It can be done, but it's not fun!  Pulling wire for
the first time can be very difficult for DIY'ers, especially in the many
places where retrofitting wiring is difficult.  I believe we both live in
such houses, although yours seems a little harder to deal with than mine.
(-:

> Other installations in US stick-built houses are often simple variations
on
> that theme including some drywall patching.

As I said to Brian, the devil lives in the details.

Did someone add extra bracing or firestops inside the wall?  Is the basement
ceiling stapled up and not a drop ceiling (mine was)?  Does the attic have
to be emptied to access the spots you need to fish wire?  Just like X-10,
rewiring goes smoothly a lot of times but turns into a bear when it doesn't.
Got paint leftover to match your repairs or will your wife insist that you
now repaint the entire room to cover any repairs?  (Mine did and that was
the last 110VAC cable I pulled!)

It's easy for me see how complicated things can get because I've been there
and done it and hate pulling wire unless there's no other option.  X-10
gives me that other option, and unlike their wireless cams, it's actually
reliable when properly installed (meters, filters, XTB'S).  My first HA
camera was an X-10.  After careful review, I knew I had better start
stringing some RG-59 and buying CCD cams with ExView sensors if I wanted
clear, high resolution images.  Yet I know that some people are quite
satisfied with their X-cams.  I'll bet both their requirements and their
environments are quite different from mine.

Remember the poor guy from Puerto Rico with the concrete house?  He's not
pulling cable any more easily than setting up and debugging X-10.  It's easy
to discount all that you and Brian know and have learned to be able to pull
your own wire.  I maintain that X-10 requires a similar level of knowledge
to be used effectively.  Lots of people feel that it shouldn't, but that's
life, I guess.  Lots of people believe computers shouldn't have so many
things to fuss with but believing it doesn't make it so.

--
Bobby G.