Re: want to see Bass trying to get out of an argument that he cant win?

[mleuck <m.leuck@xxxxxxxxx>]

On Sep 23, 2:13=A0pm, Jim Rojas <jro...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> mleuck wrote:
> > On Sep 23, 11:22 am, Jim Rojas <jro...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> >> Healthcare is a joke in this country. Those without it are much better
> >> off. Free clinics are in no short supply, and probably provide better
> >> care. Those with some sort of healthcare can expect to get dropped,
> >> denied coverage. or go bankrupt if major claim is made. That's just
> >> business as usual.
>
> > Worked just fine for me earlier this year
>
> >> Cash For Clunkers is just another example of recent government waste.
> >> Sure it is a bandaid to help the economy along, But instead of mandati=
ng
> >> that SUV's, trucks, etc., that get under 15 MPG be banned from
> >> production, someone found more loppholes to exploit. This is why this
> >> country is on a one way track to total destruction. I would like to se=
e
> >> a ban on gasoline only vehicles. Flexfuel and Hybrids make more sense.
> >> At least oil companies can easily go from refining oil to producing
> >> ethanol, no matter what special interest group says otherwise. I haven=
't
> >> bought a drop of gasoline in 3 years. There is an ethanol plant here i=
n
> >> Tampa that produces biomass E100 ethanol. There is no need to add 15
> >> percent gasoline to it, because biomass ethanol is not drinkable. I ca=
n
> >> buy 2 55 gallon drums for roughly $1.08 a gallon. This is the same
> >> product that is added to standard gasoline at the pumps...10 percent
> >> ethanol by volume.
>
> >> Jim Rojas
>
> > Cash for Clunkers is a prime example of why government should not
> > jack, they initially allotted a billion with the expectation that it
> > would last for several months when it didn't last a week. They had to
> > scramble for 2 billion more to close it out. If they can't even run
> > that....
>
> > And as far as alcohol there isn't enough farmland to create enough
> > product to power all our cars, as it is now increased alcohol
> > production takes away food crop which drives food prices higher.
>
> Ethanol can be extracted from cattle feed, without affecting that supply
> at all. It can also be made from biomass (yard waste which currently
> gets buried or burned away in most landfills. Most people don't even
> know that common table sugar comes from sugarbeets, not sugar cane.
> Sugar cane is a tropical plant. Sugarbeets can be grown just about
> anywhere. Even in those colder potato & corn growing states.

Extracting isn't the problem, the problem is cost of extracting, yes
you can get Ethanol from a lot of sources however many times you end
up using more energy to extract Ethanol than the energy Ethanol
contains which defeats the purpose. Also alcohol attracts water which
is not a good thing up north during the winter when you fuel lines
freeze. Cost of producing the product is why a lot of Ethanol
refineries where I grew up went bust.

Extracting it from sugar cane is far easier than what we can use


> Ethanol is a clear, colorless alcohol fuel made from the sugars found in
> grains, such as corn, sorghum, and wheat, as well as potato skins, rice,
> and yard clippings. Ethanol is a renewable fuel because it is made from
> plants. There are several ways to make ethanol from biomass. The most
> commonly used processes today use yeast to ferment the sugars and starch
> in corn. Corn is the main ingredient for ethanol in the United States
> due to its abundance and low price. Most ethanol is produced in the
> corn-growing states in the Midwest. The leftover mash is then dried and
> turned into cattle feed. Only the liquid ethanol is extracted.

The Midwest can't produce enough of it to satisfy our needs


> Sugar cane and sugar beets are the most common ingredients for ethanol
> in other parts of the world. Since alcohol is created by fermenting
> sugar, sugar crops are the easiest ingredients to convert into alcohol.
> Brazil, the country with the world's largest ethanol production, makes
> most of its ethanol this way. Today, many cars in Brazil operate on
> ethanol made from sugar cane.

And they didn't get there without massive government subsidies, also
they are slowly moving away from all alcohol vehicles back to more
gasoline-based engines mostly because they found a massive oil deposit
off Brazil's shores recently

> A new experimental process which breaks down cellulose in woody fibers,
> is called "cellulosic ethanol". With this process we can make ethanol
> from trees, grasses, and crop wastes. Trees and grasses need less energy
> than grains, which must be replanted every year.
>
> Using ethanol means that we use a alot less gasoline (a nonrenewable
> fuel). Unlike gasoline, ethanol is nontoxic (safe to handle) and
> biodegradable, it quickly breaks down into harmless substances if
> spilled. When small amounts of ethanol are added to gasoline, usually
> less than 10 percent, there are many advantages. Ethanol reduces carbon
> monoxide and other toxic pollution from the tailpipes of vehicles,
> making the air cleaner. It keeps engines running smoothly without the
> need for lead or other chemical additives.
>
> We need to stop listening to the special interest groups. There is
> plenty of renewable energy sources, if we bothered to look elsewhere
> than foreign oil fields. We spend billions on explorastion and
> extracting it from the ground, why not spend just as much growing it,
> and keeping the cash in American pockets? We complain that we outsource
> everything these days. Now its time to change that as well.
>
> Jim Rojas

Easier said than done which is why we are a gasoline based society