Re: FYI ADT fans

[Frank Olson <use_the_email_links@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

tourman wrote:
> On Mar 7, 11:23 am, Frank Olson
> <use_the_email_li...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> tourman wrote:
>>
>>> RHC: There are different kinds of "shit". Personal stuff that relates
>>> to people I don't bother with; it has no place on a professionally
>>> oriented newsgroup. Stuff that relates to industry practices is fair
>>> game.
>> OK...  So the next time he spams the group with reams of useless shit,
>> or flames the individuals in this "professionally oriented newsgroup",
>> you're going to just ignore it (as you have in the past) because it's
>> "personal" and not related to "industry practices".  Check.
>>
>> Bass recently characterized the supposed actions of a direct online
>> competitor (Nassau Security) as "criminal" although he's never provided
>> either examples (of criminal behaviour) or any further information.  In
>> the very same post, he'd also falsely accused me of "recommending" them
>> (and even gone so far as to say that I listed them on my website at one
>> time).  So where would you suggest we "draw the line"?  What "industry
>> practices" would you consider "fair game"?  I'm not trying to be
>> confrontational, Bob.  I'd just like you to expand upon your comments.
>
> RHC: Frank, I've been on this newsgroup for many years and I've stated
> my position many times. I am here to comment on our industry, to give
> what little technical assistance I can to people coming on line, to
> learn from the many professionals here who are far more capable than I
> am on technical matters relating to those aspects of electronic
> equipment that interest me. Period !! I will NOT engage in any manner
> of personal attack on anyone here (although I've come close with one
> of the members I have to admit, but then who's perfect ! ) As soon as
> I see a thread going downhill to personal levels (and it seems most
> do...), I don't even bother to read it anymore.

I respect that.


>
> Nothing personal here Frank, but I don't give a damn what anyone
> thinks of how I conduct myself on the newsgroup. Keep it civil, and
> I'll discuss things even if they get off topic. Get insulting to
> anyone in any fashion and I'm gone ! This is not the real world; it's
> only a friggin virtual newsgroup for Chise sakes ! If I choose to
> actually meet anyone on the group (and I have), it has nothing to do
> with the newsgroup - period !

I wasn't criticizing your behaviour (or the way you conduct yourself in
the newsgroup).  I was only asking where you "draw the line".  It seems
to me that your experiences with ADT have been somewhat dissimilar from
mine.  Our experiences with AlarmFarce are more in sync.  Bass has based
his attack on Nassau Security on what??  One complaint filed at a
"rip-off" reporting site?  Do you consider that "industry related"??
What about the comment about my listing them?  Since when have online
security stores become part of our profession?  It seems to me that a
lot of them "feed" on the fear and misunderstanding people have about
what professional alarm dealers do (and what they want in the way of a
contract).  Now I know you're not one for a long term contract and I
respect your business philosophy (after all you've been successfully
promoting it in the Carlton area for many years).  But at least you're
still *in* the business of installing and servicing alarms.


>
> Lately, I have really begun to doubt the worth of continuing here. Few
> newcomers come in these days without having to endure the usual litany
> of sarcastic comments simply because they may be trying to find
> information which some in the group feel should be the domain of
> professional installers etc.

I get pretty discouraged when I see that too.  I put it down to "some
people have a problem about giving free advice".  If you've taken the
time to review the history of this group you'll find that the way the
majority "feel" about it more closely mirrors the "original purpose
message".


> Or they endure insults because they won't
> hire a professional company to do the job.

You've gotta admit that some post with an "attitude" that doesn't merit
a polite response.  It's not like we haven't heard it all before.  I'm
of the opinion that you have to give your best and I recognize that it's
not always easy for a DIY to interpret a manual geared towards a trained
professional (that may even have had some "one on one" with the
manufacturer in an industry sponsored seminar).


> Those who engage in that
> level of comment really ought to ask themselves how their customers
> would see them, and whether or not they would act that way if the
> party asking the question was indeed a paying customer.

First off, what paying customer would be asking you how to program their
panel (or for the installer code)??  I don't think you've quite thought
this answer through.  You may be thinking that I'm trying to trap you
into saying something "negative" (or changing your opinion) about Bass.
  I'm not.  I think his actions (and how he conducts himself in this
newsgroup particularly) speak for themselves.  If you choose to meet him
and enjoy his company that's not something I have any right to comment
on (at least publicly).  Come to think of it, I might have (at some
time) done so (or responded to another individual about it).  That still
doesn't make it right.  Personally, I don't want to meet him and I
sincerely doubt I ever will (want to).