Re: DIY - Sometimes....

[Jim <alarminex@xxxxxxx>]

On Jan 9, 3:46=EF=BF=BDpm, tourman <robercampb...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> RHC: Nope ! Dead wrong ! There are lots of companies that offer month
> to month terms. They may ask for one year payment up front (which
> makes it pretty much like a one year term), but the contract term is
> month to month. Maybe not in your area, but becoming much more common
> in ours (while before I used to be the only one....)

I guess you're trying to say that .... in the land of the blind, one
more blind person doesn't matter. (just kidding)

>
> As far as servicing non monitored accounts, it is a matter of time
> resources as much as anything else. With a large customer base ( too
> large actually), I much prefer to maintain my allegiance to my RMR
> paying customers. Same thing when I get asked to do video, telephone
> wiring, cat 5 wiring, or simple pre wiring, I turn it away - no time !
>
I can understand it from that point of view. Which I sometimes do
also. But, for instance. Just recently someone called me as a
referral. As the story turned out .....the man was beginning a new job
and would be traveling now. They'd had an old Radionics panel put in
long time ago. Had no information on it, didn't even remember how to
arm it. Never used it from the day they moved in. They didn't want
monitoring just wanted to turn it on. I said I couldn't turn it on
because I didn't do Radionics, and I didn't have the programer or
dealer codes necessary to unlock it. So even for a local system I'd
have to change out the equipment. They asked how much.

Main Panel, four kepads, two inoperable motion detectors, 3 old smoke
detectors, some dislocated contacts, replace glass shock sensors that
had been cut to replace some windows. Add a motion detector in the
basement, wire the new windows and doors that had been added in the
basement apartment, replace an old back up power supply, test every
single audio glass break detector (one in every room except for shocks
on bath windows). Job was close to $3000.00. Warrenteed for a year and
I'll gladly service it. From my point of view, I've got a trouble free
account with no false alarm reports going to police. And the main
thing is, I knew I would get a call to monitor it or at the least I
was going to get some referrals out of the job I did for them because
I gave them exactly what they wanted, which ( I'm guessing) no one
else would.

I guess you'd turn it down .... huh?


>
>
> > Annnnnnd yet you promote the fact that physical security is so very
> > very important and should always be employed. And you've said that you
> > were in the physical security business .......only, for years before
> > you offered alarm systems. So what would be wrong with having just one
> > more deterrent like a local alarm system? =EF=BF=BDSeems rather duplicit=
ous to
> > me that on one hand you say that you're so magnanimous with regard to
> > your clients and won't lock them into a long term contract, even
> > though it's detrimental to the value of your company, but you don't
> > seem to have a problem turning away people who don't want to pay you
> > for monitoring.
>
> RHC: I don't know why I bother to even answer such a weird comparison,
> but I will on this subject. If you truly believe that physical
> security is only an "optional extra" that goes with the alarm, then
> you are either deceiving your customers or you are a total amateur,
> regardless of number of years in the business !!

Where did I say it was optional? One of the things I do on a survey it
to point out lack of double keyed dead bolts, poor outdoor lighting,
accessable openings .... always ask about fire extinguishers too. I
didn't get here by luck.

My point was, you sold physical security, but didn't NOT sell it if
they didn't have an alarm. Now, ( I think you've said) you wont sell
an alarm unless they have physical security, and then here add that
you wont sell an alarm unless it's monitored. So uniquely enough, you
infer that physical security alone is better than physical security
plus a non monitored alarm system which logically is not true.

> And on the matter of
> the alarm, it's the "option" of the two - electronic versus physical.
> But if you do put in an alarm as part of the customer's security plan,
> you do it correctly (which means it's always monitored), or you don't
> do it at all - period !

That sounds like the AHJ and their asinine rules about fire alarms. If
a little mom and pop store wants to put in a smoke detector or two in
their store attached to their burg panel, the fire marshal says no, ya
can't do that. You have to put in a whole seperate panel, pull
stations, heat detectors, two phone lines, 24hour check-in Blah blah
blah!  Yeah sure. It's better to have no fire alarm than some form of
detecton. As a matter of fact, based on your logic, they shouldn't
even put in local smoke detectors.


>And as I said a bit later in the thread, yes,
> a local alarm has some merit, but IMO and in our area with the noise
> bylaws, not much.

So if someone said they wanted a non monitored alarm system with an
inside siren, along with physical security, you wouldn't install it?
Around here, hardly anyone puts up outside sounders anymore. The logic
is, since no one ever responds to a siren nowdays anyway, the
important one that you want to hear the siren is the intruder. What
better place to put it then, but inside the house where they can hear
it. Also,  obviously, the importance of an inside location is
increased with a fire alarm.

> Frankly, alarms of all sorts are overrated....they
> are one more thing that discourages a thief from coming up to the
> premises, and they limit the time inside (thereby the losses), but
> they don't stop anyone from coming in...

Well if you get right down to it .... anyone with a purpose can get
through any kind of physical security you could provide too. Ever have
a house broken into with a chain saw? Do you fortify attic gable
vents, or pull down attic stairs or ceilings in all rooms accesable
from the attic ? Do you fortify the panels on an overhead garage door
and the all the garage windows and/or fortify the drywall between the
house and the garage? Do you fortify all the panels in a door so that
they can't be kicked or cut through? Obviously not. Most people
wouldn't want to pay for it, look at it or live with it in their face
every day and the possibilities of someone going to all that effort to
get in, is not likely.

Like wise, most alarm systems don't cover every single opening or
possible point of entry but the same as with fortifying the most
obvious points with physical security, ........   alarm systems do the
same thing. Each point covered/protected, being one more thing in
favor of acting as a deterrent. Monitoring simply lets the people know
that something has already occured.

Now ...... As you said above ....  and I quote

"Frankly, alarms of all sorts are overrated....they
are one more thing that discourages a thief from coming up to the
premises, and they limit the time inside (thereby the losses), but
they don't stop anyone from coming in..."

So from your lips ....  a monitored alarm system isn't going to stop
anyone ......  and likewise ........ obvioulsy no more than an NON
monitored alarm system. Then what the hell is the difference whether
you install it with or with the monitoring ? The perp has no idea
whether it's monitored or not.  .......... So what's the big thing
about not installing a non monitored alarm system if it isn't solely
for the fact that you want the RMR? Which puts you right in the same
category as all those greedy people you accuse of only wanting to scam
their customers with long term contracts.

So, ..... you only contract month to month, but you know they're going
to stay with you as long as you give them good service. Your ploy of
"saying" they can leave you at any time is quite empty, as a matter of
fact, because both you and I know that you WILL provide them good
service and that you WILL therefore keep the account. So it's not that
you're really risking anthing at all, it's all in what perspective
you've provided to the client to value in the relationship. " You can
leave anytime you want" That makes him feel good but you know that
you're not going to lose him because of anything that you do. My
customers get the same options. Anyone can leave when ever they want.
( I've only just recently gave one person a hard time for specific
reasons and they knew they were wrong and paid off the balance of the
contract.) Under similar circumstances you would have lost out
entirely on a lot of hard work. I contract for longer periods,
but,unlike you,  (in spite of what myth someone has spun you) I am, in
FACT, acquiring equity in my business, and, same as you,  providing
the service my clients want and expect,  to add to the value of my
company.

>
>
> > > 3- With too many accounts now, I reserve my limited time and energy
> > > for servicing my RMR paying customers.
>
> > And I'd imagine at about this point you've occasionally wondered how
> > much more you could be making on service calls, =EF=BF=BDummmmm that is =
if you
> > didn't have another source of income for yourself and if you really
> > wanted to give your son a business that had some greater worth.
>
> RHC: The service that is included are such things as batteries and
> contacts for door and window changes. Any other actual physical work
> is charged at local rates. Service is "something that goes wrong",
> and is "free" kind of like the alarm system sold as "free" ...it's
> bundled in the rate along with the warranty. Only my rate structures
> don't screw the client as do the rates of the ADT's and Brinks of the
> world....
>
Well ....well.... well. I'm really glad to hear that Bob. At least
there's some hope on the horizon. The impression that you've given all
these years is that all follow up service on an installation is free
forever. I mean, even what you're doing isn't normal and, in my
opinion, has got to really exacerbate it's self, with useless minor
calls for piddly stuff that you wouldn't normally be called for, if
they had to pay for it. But ...... you're "free service" that's not
really free ............ doesn't that again put you somewhat in the
category of the companies that you often deride for being ummmmm less
than honest? I mean, not alot ...... just sorta?

>
>
> > > I gladly help people when they call me, but I simply won't waste my
> > > time (even billable time) on a local system. Luckily, virtually
> > > everyone I deal with sees the logic in
> > > having their alarm monitored properly, especially when it comes
> > > bundled with service and 100% warranty and all at a reasonable market
> > > price !
>
> > Sure ..... in the same way that the people who get the "Free" alarms
> > installed. =EF=BF=BDThere are always people out there looking to get som=
ething
> > for nothing and by giving away a piece of the equity of your business
> > to every customer, that's what they get. Something for nothing. =EF=BF=
=BDOf
> > COURSE they see the logic to it ..... =EF=BF=BDIt's just that they don't=
 know
> > what you're giving up to give them what you do.
>
> RHC: What I appear to be "giving away" is nothing more than providing
> a bundled service to my clients and at rates which are a FAR better
> deal than say the Borg would give. And as far as the equity in the
> business, I know PRECISELY what the accounts are worth...to the
> dollar. And your whole premise (in my case anyway) is also dead
> wrong !

Sorry Bob, but people are people and as much as they'll tell you one
thing today, when it gets right down to the cash on the table, you
know damn well with the final line is going to be. "If you had
contracted accounts, you'd have gotten a lot more for them"
>
> I've said all I'm going to say because I really don't give a damn what
> a person such as you thinks. That clear enough for you ?

Obvioulsly not.

You did reply.