Re: pir false alarms

["Bob Worthy" <securinc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

<joble_5@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1164205631.533312.195170@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Hi,
>
> we have an alarm for 2,5 years now. It is a Rokonet system. The PIR
> detector's used are Pyronix Magnum Ultra.
>
> It worked fine for more than 2 years, but last summer we had false
> alarms almost once per week. Always on the same sensor. Sensor was
> replaced by the installer, but next night there was again a false
> alarm.
>
> The Pir is now replaced by a dual detector, and this detector seems to
> work well.
>
> The next week we had false alarms with both the two other PIR's. So
> they are also replaces by dual's.
>
> Now it has worked fine for 3 months. But the installer sends us a bill
> for the replacement of the first detector. And i think another bill for
> the two others will follow. Together this is the 25% of the price of
> the system!

I know it seems confusing when one looks at the original price of
installation. Is your system being monitored? If so, some in the industry
will discount to initial price of the system and make up the rest of the
cost over the length of the monitoring arrangement. Secondly, the dual tech
motions can be two to three times the cost of some of the single technology
PIR's.

I do not think this is normal after 2,5 years. (The
> warranty of the system is 1 year, but on the pyronix site i read the
> pir detectors come with 5 years of warranty)

That is probably the manufactures warranty which are misleading if you don't
really read them. It is not "over the counter" exchange through the
distributor in most cases. Over the counter warranty exchange is relatively
short. 30 days is normal. After that, it most likely would be a technician
taking it down, paying for shipping, sending it to the manufacturer,
possibly a bench charge if nothing is found to be wrong, shipping back, a
technician coming back to re-install either the new one, the repaired one or
the same one if the manufacturer could not simulate the problem through
testing. The manufacturer (no matter which one) will not pay for the
technicians labor, travel, overhead, etc. even if the warranty is honored.
The one year warranty, the installation company gave you, is from them and
usually will cover parts and labor. Two different type of warrantys coming
from two different entities. Manufacturers warranty's are not as great as
they sound.
>
>
> I want to argue with the installer but first i want to learn more about
> the problem.

Being in the trade, believe me, we appreciate that.

>So i have some questions:
>
> Is it possible that a fly triggers the pir?

Not familiar with this particular PIR but will try to give some insight for
you to make your decision. You mentioned that the PIR worked well for a
couple of years. If a fly is a concern, I would think that the PIR has seen
a fly or two over those two years without tripping. It is possible but not
probable a fly would set off a PIR.

> Can this problem be due to bad adjustment of the pir or the use of the
> wrong lenses?

Again, the PIR was fine for an extended amount of time with the existing
settings and lenses. Unless you made some changes to the environment (area)
the PIR is located in, which could effect the PIR's intended use or
settings, this shouldn't be the problem. Changes could be very suttle, or
simply adding a piece of furniture or wall hanging could be enough. The lens
will change how the PIR is viewing the area, but unless it is dirty, greasy,
cobwebs, paint spray, etc. or again making a change to the area, this should
not be a problem either. Did someone try to clean the lens with a harsh
cleaner of some sort?

> Can the reason be in the rokonet system instead of in the PIR's?

Not if the new Dual Tech's are working fine. The only device that may cause
you problems is the battery. If it is not holding the system up during a
power fluctuation, the motions can false. Do you have power problems in your
area periodically? Have you had any since the motions were changed to see if
the new ones are effected by power outages? When was the last time you had
the battery changed? Dual techs, because of the microwave, are a little more
power hungry. Adding a battery with a little more Ah (amp hours) is
advisable especially since I don't know what other power devices you have on
the system.

> Any other ideas???

It sounds like whatever was happening, it was effecting the passive infrared
portion of the detector. By adding the dual tech (addition of microwave and
passive) it is overcoming the problem. It makes me think that something
changed to effect the passive. It is not likely that three motion detectors
will go bad weeks apart. See if anything changed in the home, not that it
matters if the problem has been resolved, but for your comfort level. Look
for something, take the blinders off, that occured just prior to your first
false alarm.