Re: receiving serial data/email alerts?

[Kevin Hawkins <lists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Paul Gale wrote:

> Thanks Mark,
>
> xAPHomeVision sounds good :)
>
xAP HomeVision has been released for a while - but the great news is
that the updated version Mark is about to release supports the latest
xAP BSC v1.3 - this makes it ideal to integrate in an almost plug and
play way with other BSC apps/devices.  Nice one Mark...

> I've got several devices that either report status or are controllable
> via RS232. My current (remembered) list includes:
>
> ·       Extron MAV128 video matrix switcher - at the heart of my AV
> switching system
> ·       Panasonic plasma TV
> ·       Onkyo Amp
> ·       Onkyo DVD player
> ·       Aquarium computer
>
> All of these devices have been 'on my list' to integrate with my HA
> system but I've never got around to doing yet!
>
> If there was some kind of xAP application, using a PC's standard
> serial ports, USB to serial or serial add-in card, that could
> communicate with a serial device and have a set of logic to do
> something with that data, that would be great. I'm thinking of the
> kind of logic that HV allows and the resultant actions would be xAP
> messages. Does that make sense?
>
Yep - xAP BSC Framework - but you will always have to write code for
handling the specific protocol the device uses.  HV can't form custom
xAP messages as it has no network connection and insufficient memory and
limited macro capabilities in the string handling area.

> I wonder whether broadcasting the serial data via xAP would also be
> desirable? - would I really want to do this I wonder?
>
The reason is that xAP is broadcast - everything should hear everything
else. - abstracting the serial protocol to a xAP schema is the ideal way
so instead of getting 0D1A492C<cr>  you see
"Source=Fishtank" "Temp=26"
in a xAP message  (simplified a little)  and/or an equivalent BSC
message like  Level=26.

> I guess an easier(?) xAP approach to dealing with serial data is to
> pass it all into HV and let HV's logic deal with it.
>
Maybe 'easier' in the sense it's only handing the responsibility for
implementing the protocol elsewhere, a sort of 'cop out' .   At some
stage the protocol of the device has to be supported, if you have ever
tried implementing checksums etc on HV you will soon hit limitations,
(he said having had to do this for C-Bus).  Also you have to be able to
form and react to xAP messages sent directly to the device.  Crucially
HomeVision does not sit on a network and hence can't (indeed shouldn't)
do this.  HV does not have the speed, memory, language capability or
hardware (Ethernet) to do this.

I think the reason you are persuing this is that you are comfortable
with HV's macro language and would like to control a whole xAP HA system
via that, unfortunately that isn't going to be possible as HV is not a
xAP controller, it can set flags and trigger events that get transferred
to xAP but it will require a 'helper app' to fully interact with xAP.
Let me clarify that...  xAP HomeVision using BSC v1.3 can create links
with other BSCv1.3 devices.  So when HV input 1 goes ON then your
Bedroom lamp goes ON.  Also (I believe) flags can do the same and
variables presumably map to BSC level devices eg a dimmer.  You can do
this really simply (no programming) by using BSC Mapper or a similar
functionality that xAP Floorplan offers.  So yes HV can work very well
this way with xAP with no programming required....(for simple devices ie
BSC)

However serial protocol handling is more complex...  crucially the
serial architecture in HV is rather basic in that it does not handle
buffering or concurrent processing of data from multiple serial ports,
and get's stalled by X10 etc. It is really only intended for low speed
data from a few sources , pushing many serial streams into HV will only
cause data to be missed or received incorrectly and impact the stability
and realtime responsiveness of HV , which is very undersireable as the
beauty of HV is that it is so rock solid.  BTW I use two HV's (one std
one pro)  as my core engine im my home for exactly this 'always works'
reason. PC crashes - lights still work.

So what  you should be looking for is how to get the logic/scheduling
setup in HV and then an application that you enlist to handle the xAP
side.   ......  and :-) we have HomeSeer,  BSC Mapper, xAP Desktop and
xAP Floorplan, the latter two being free.  For direct  links then BSC
Mapper is ideal and if you need some more 'smarts' but still want ease
of understanding then xAP Floorplan is the likely candidate (for more
power and realtime PC display then xAP Desktop).  HomeSeer is a very
polished and popular end user HA application and many people are
comfortable with that , and it supports direct scripting (VB) for
multiple serial ports for example.  It fully interacts with BSC and the
vast library of HS devices become 'xAP' devices automatically.

> I'm thinking of a direct xAP replacement for ACE's serial handling
> capability (mapping and passing through to HV). In this case, it would
> be great if the xAP application could combine several serial sources
> and pass them on to HV. Maybe also with some kind of identifier as to
> which serial source the data has come from (although most of my kit
> has unique protocols) i.e. appending a couple of characters to the
> beginning of the message and a termination character at the end? This
> approach would be fantastic as it would allow easy addition of
> multiple serial ports to HV.
>
> The reverse flow of data from HV out to the serial ports may also have
> a couple of designator characters as well, which the xAP application
> would strip off before sending the data to the relevant port.
>
> Does that all sound feasible?
>
Yes, I understand what you are tring to achieve, but it really isn't xAP
as you are not presenting the data to other nodes (ie is not broadcast)
and you are not ultimately abstracting it as a schema even when received
and decoded.   xAP isn't the way to get reformatted (escaped) serial
data into HV.      Additionally HV is not very capable at handling
protocols (eg checksums or timing) and has relatively little memory and
this would impact it's speed and stability. HV also can't hear, process
or form xAP messages.   If such an app was written then it wouldn't be a
xAP app as such - more a HV expansion app. (which is sort of where ACE
came from).

To a limited extent the xAP HomeVision conduit could support a feature
where you configured a few 'template' messages that were sent in
response to HV triggers and perhaps populated with string data from HV,
likewise it could receive a few of these and pass data to HV.  But  I
feel (and I don't want to speak on behalf of someone else who wrote this
app) it moves in the wrong direction doing this.  You end up with multi
function applications rather than distributing function .  HV should be
a 'peripheral' for xAP that has extensive I/O and can schedule and
receive/ issue triggers.  Where there is more than a direct 'linkage'
required , ie parameters/messages have to be formed from text strings or
in your case serial protocols handled then a helper application  - a xAP
engine if you like would perform this and HV just isnt capable of
that.     A serial protocol handler in xAP would take say your amplifier
and present as a xap-audio device on xAP.

> It's one of the next biggest hurdles for me to integrate xAP even
> further into my HA system.
>
I think you have to take the leep into learning a bit of VB script to
realise your goal here.   You have so many serial devices (10+ ..wow)
that having a PC handle them is probably the right way (ACE ?) - or
certainly you will need a more powerful and capable embedded solution
than HV - this is sort of where products like HomeBrain were focussing.
Or maybe a couple of HomeVisions even ??   Also some protocols are just
too complex for HV - for example the serial protocol on my TagMclaren
HiFi (TagTronic) or true C-Bus  .   As you delve further into things
like say music (mp3) then the memory & string handling capabilities of
HV just aren't adequate.

HV is an excellent ON OFF or LEVEL based solution (which is why I use
it) but wasn't engineered for richer devices.  For me it is an engine
for C-Bus lighting and X10, some IR, and mostly importantly an embedded
scheduler and logic engine that always works so key functions in my
house are rock solid.

> Oh, and is there a xAP scheduler available yet - something that can
> rival the power of the HV scheduler?
>
Yep...

xAP Floorplan

HomeSeer


> Cheers,
>
> Paul.
>
Kevin