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RE: Smartthings?
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This is one of the biggest issues with HA kit. Keeping it WORKING.
CBUS standalone is rock solid but then you don't gave the HA features you
want. I wish I could install that here.
Most of us are married so the systems have to be 110% WAF or we will be in
trouble. I have a mix of home brew and commercial and to be honest, the
home
brew is far more reliable. :)
I use a mixture of Zwave and Zibgbee (WEMO) for the commercial and most of
the time it works. The biggest failure is relying on the Internet
connectivity for things like IFTT for the WEMO control via Homeseer. If the
Internet is down, it all fails. This is why my own systems just work as
they
are only reliant on my WiFi or Zigbee and they always work even without the
Internet.
The Zwave on its own just works with Homeseer but to add the functionality
to make it more usable needs additional support and that is where it falls
over.
The most recent addition of EP8266 based modules has been faultless and
just
works as long as the WiFi us up which is pretty much always. If the
Internet
goes down, they still work.
Dave.
---
Very funny Scotty, now beam down my clothes.
---
From: ukha_d@xxxxxxx [mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 07 December 2015 20:21
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] Smartthings?
Hi Kevin,
Thanks for that detailed response - mmm, I did scan a few long threads
about
problems. Sounds worse than I thought. I think I'll hold off for a while
then.
Seems that the mass market HA devices and controllers all have huge issues.
Do they just under-estimate the amount of effort required to get these
things working I wonder - or are they just incompetent?
The HC2 is still a long way off from working well too it seems with poor
support. My motion sensor LUX level still only works intermittently. The
interface and GUI looks nice but when you get down to it, it's still very
clunky and isn't very useable, let alone by anyone else in the house!
What I'm wondering currently is if there's a way to detect a Hue scene
being
triggered (or even a hue lamp being triggered) and then turning on a Z-Wave
plug socket? The Hue plugin doesn't seem very capable at all unfortunately.
Cheers,
Paul.
From: ukha_d@xxxxxxx [mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 07 December 2015 12:46
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Smartthings?
Hi Paul,
I have SmartThings Hub and a couple of Hue bulbs with the HomeKit
compatible
hub.
Quick answer to your subject title ... No . SmartThings (v2) is a really
screwed up offering currently. SmartThings and Samsung should be ashamed of
this product technically, their premature UK launch and their subsequent
support.
Worldwide it has loads of problems and their original goal with the V2 hub
of offering local processing just hasn't proved deliverable It does almost
everything via the cloud and so is Internet dependent and has corresponding
latency issues. This just doesn't make sense when direct local IP , ZigBee
or Z-Wave control is available. Even when local processing is improved
the
code still has to be delivered currently within a firmware update from ST !
The scheduling works for a day and then frequently fails. Erratic
behaviour, lots of bugs. Over time I'm confident they will fix things but
things move slowly in ST/Samsung land at the moment. Have a look over the
community forum posts.
In the UK things are much much worse :-( Samsung created a European server
that requires different authorisation for adding applications and devices.
This meant that all such additions that use authorisation didn't work in
the
UK. I feel sure they knew this at launch in Sept but just ignored it to
meet a trade show / Xmas marketing deadline. Their subsequent support
handling of this issue was truly awful with UK support clearly left in the
dark about progress. They blatantly advertised device compatibility and
continued to do, which just isn't available. Over two months (!) later
they released a partial fix but this still requires all plugin authors to
change their code - so still there's only a handful of plugins available in
the UK. Samsung also have a 'UK supported' device approach which means
that several devices available in the US are not easily installable on UK
product , nor ever will be.
They have a long way to go yet to even get the UK product on a par with the
US (actually they never will) - and in the meantime they still have to make
the US product stable. Even then a cloud only product is not something I
would want for my home control. There's talk they might even need a new
hardware hub to actually deliver on their goal for local processing.
Whether enforcing the cloud architecture is actually desirable for their
business model remains a concern to users. The one thing ST has going for
it is that potentially it's a huge volume product and will achieve
widespread device compatibility and that could bring HA to the mass market.
Having said that Hue works well on ST . However, and I need to double
check,
I don't think Hue is controlled locally by SmartThings - it's a cloud link.
Using your HC2 you could just include a Z-Wave plug/relay in a scene for
the
Christmas tree lights, you could do the same on ST or even use a ZigBee
plug. The ST peripherals are all ZigBee based (and seem to have high
failure
rates). You wouldn't have HomeKit control of the Christmas tree lights
though. You could I suppose kludge a Hue strip controller into operating a
relay, or much easier using HC2 setup a state change event from a spare
Hue
lamp to kick off a scene to control the Z-Wave plug.
K
On 07/12/2015 10:37, Paul Gale groups2@xxxxxxx [ukha_d] wrote:
Many people here using SmartThings? How about with Philips Hue?
Now I don't currently have a proper HA infrastructure (after moving I don't
now have Cbus, Comfort, homevision etc), I'm experimenting with wireless
and
newer more mainstream devices. I do have a Fibaro HC2 and an increasing
number of Philips Hue lamps. They're good but struggling to get anywhere
near the configurability, feedback and control of my old system with Cbus.
I
know they're very different beasts of course.
Just wondering if SmartThings is a good system to link some of this
together?
For example, I have a Hue scene in the living room that turns on a couple
of
table lamps and Iris colour lamps. I thought it would be good to integrate
the Christmas tree lights into a new scene but Hue doesn't offer a plug
relay/dimmer. I'm tending to control this all through Apple Homekit and
Siri
- which is quite good actually. But not sure if both Smartthings and Hue
work well together? Thoughts?
Thanks,
Paul.
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<div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><a
name="_MailEndCompose"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>This
is one of the biggest issues with HA kit. Keeping it WORKING.
<o:p></o:p></span></a></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>CBUS
standalone is rock solid but then you don't gave the HA features you want.
I wish I could install that
here.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana"
,"sans-serif"'>Most of us are married so the systems have to
be 110% WAF or we will be in trouble. I have a mix of home brew and
commercial and to be honest, the home brew is far more reliable.
:)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='font
-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>I
use a mixture of Zwave and Zibgbee (WEMO) for the commercial and most of
the time it works. The biggest failure is relying on the Internet
connectivity for things like IFTT for the WEMO control via Homeseer. If the
Internet is down, it all fails. This is why my own systems just work as
they are only reliant on my WiFi or Zigbee and they always work even
without the Internet.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>The
Zwave on its own just works with Homeseer but to add the f
unctionality to make it more usable needs additional support and that is
where it falls over.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-famil
y:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>The
most recent addition of EP8266 based modules has been faultless and just
works as long as the WiFi us up which is pretty much always. If the
Internet goes down, they still
work.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'>Dave…<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span lang
=EN-US
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>---<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNormal><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Very
funny Scotty, now beam down my
clothes…<o:p></o:p></span></p><p
class=MsoNorma
l><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>---<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div
style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm
0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
ukha_d@xxxxxxx [mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx]
<br><b>Sent:</b> 07 December 2015
20:21<br><b>To:</b>
ukha_d@xxxxxxx<br><b>Subject:</b> RE: [ukha_d]
Smartthings?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div&g
t;</div><p
class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><div
id=ygrp-mlmsg><div id=ygrp-msg><div
id=ygrp-text><div><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Hi
Kevin,</span><o:p>
</o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Thanks for
that detailed response – mmm, I did scan a few long threads about
problems. Sounds worse than I thought. I think I’ll hold off for
a while then.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Seems that
the mass market HA devices a
nd controllers all have huge issues. Do they just under-estimate the amount
of effort required to get these things working I wonder – or are
they just incompetent?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=Mso
Normal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>The HC2 is
still a long way off from working well too it seems with poor support. My
motion sensor LUX level still only works intermittently. The interface and
GUI looks nice but when you get down to it, it’s still very
clunky and isn’t very useable, let alone by anyone else in the
house!</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style=
'font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>What
I’m wondering currently is if there’s a way to detect a
Hue scene being triggered (or even a hue lamp being trigg
ered) and then turning on a Z-Wave plug socket? The Hue plugin
doesn’t seem very capable at all
unfortunately.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Cheers,</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Paul.<o:p></o:p></p></div><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>&
;nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div
style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm
0cm'><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
lang=EN-US>From:<
/span></b><span lang=EN-US> <a href="mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx";>ukha_d@xxxxxxx</a>
[<a href="mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx";>mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx</a>]
<br><b>Sent:</b> 07 December 2015
12:46<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:ukha_d@xxxxxxx";>ukha_d@xxxxxxx</a><br><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [ukha_d]
Smartthings?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p
class
=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Hi
Paul,<br><br>I have SmartThings Hub and a couple of Hue bulbs
with the HomeKit compatible hub. <br><br>Quick answer to your
subject title ... No . SmartThings (v2) is a really screwed up
offering currently. SmartThings and Samsung should be ashamed of this
product technically, their premature UK launch and their subsequent su
pport.<br><br>Worldwide it has loads of problems and their
original goal with the V2 hub of offering local processing just hasn't
proved deliverable It does almost everything via the cloud and so
is Internet dependent and has corresponding latency issues. This just
doesn't make sense when direct local IP , ZigBee or Z-Wave control is
available. Even when local processing is improved the code still
has to be delivered currently within a firmware update from ST ! The
scheduling works for a day and then frequently fails. Erratic
behaviour, lots of bugs. Over time I'm confident they will fix
things but things move slowly in ST/Samsung land at the moment. Have a look
over the community forum posts.<br><br>In the UK things are
much much worse :-( Samsung created a European server that
requires different authorisation for adding applications and devices. This
meant that all such additions that use authorisation didn't work in the
UK.&nb
sp; I feel sure they kn
ew this at launch in Sept but just ignored it to meet a trade show / Xmas
marketing deadline. Their subsequent support handling of this issue was
truly awful with UK support clearly left in the dark about
progress. They blatantly advertised device
compatibility and continued to do, which just isn't available.
Over two months (!) later they released a partial fix but this
still requires all plugin authors to change their code - so still there's
only a handful of plugins available in the
UK. Samsung also have a 'UK supported' device
approach which means that several devices available in the US are not
easily installable on UK product , nor ever will
be.<br><br>They have a long way to go yet to even get the UK
product on a par with the US (actually they never will) - and in the
meantime they still have to make the US product stable. Even then
a cloud only product is not something I would want for my home
control.&nb
sp; There's talk
they might even need a new hardware hub to actually deliver on their goal
for local processing. Whether enforcing the cloud architecture is
actually desirable for their business model remains a concern to
users. The one thing ST has going for it is that
potentially it's a huge volume product and will achieve widespread device
compatibility and that could bring HA to the mass
market.<br><br>Having said that Hue works well on ST . However,
and I need to double check, I don't think Hue is controlled
locally by SmartThings - it's a cloud link. Using your HC2 you
could just include a Z-Wave plug/relay in a scene for the Christmas tree
lights, you could do the same on ST or even use a ZigBee plug. The ST
peripherals are all ZigBee based (and seem to have high failure
rates). You wouldn't have HomeKit control of the Christmas tree
lights though. You could I suppose kludge a Hue strip controller into
operating a relay, or much easier
using HC2 setup
a state change event from a spare Hue lamp to kick off a scene to
control the Z-Wave plug.
<br><br>K<br><br><br><br>On 07/12/2015
10:37, Paul Gale <a href="mailto:groups2@xxxxxxx";>groups2@xxxxxxx</a>
[ukha_d] wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote
style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Many people
here using SmartThings? How about with Philips
Hue?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al
t:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Now I
don’t currently have a proper HA infrastructure (after moving I
don’t now have Cbus, Comfort, homevision etc), I’m
experimenting with wireless and newer mo
re mainstream devices. I do have a Fibaro HC2 and an increasing number of
Philips Hue lamps. They’re good but struggling to get anywhere
near the configurability, feedback and control of my old system with Cbus.
I know they’re very different beasts of
course.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Just
wondering if SmartThings is a good system to link some of this
together?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p>&
lt;/p><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>For
example, I have a Hue scene in the living roo
m that turns on a couple of table lamps and Iris colour lamps. I thought it
would be good to integrate the Christmas tree lights into a new scene but
Hue doesn’t offer a plug relay/dimmer. I’m tending to
control this all through Apple Homekit and Siri – which is quite
good actually. But not sure if both Smartthings and Hue work well together?
Thoughts?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Thanks,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-to
p-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Paul.<o:p></o:p></p><p
class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote><p class=MsoNormal
style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br><br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p
class=MsoNormal><span
style='color:white'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div>
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