Re: was: Re: Idratek - Serious Contender? Now: Alternative to clipsal switches in C-Bus Install

[Kevin Hawkins <lists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Nigel Giddings wrote:
> Kevin,
>
> It's my understanding that the AUX units can also provide the scene
triggers, dim, etc... I agree I will be losing the indicators which is a
definite downside.
>
> The reason for using the C-Bus Aux units is that they are 'Clipsal'
units.
>
Yes - I guess it's just a cost issue as Aux inputs are still quite
expensive - if you're commoning a lot of switches that saves quite a bit
in required inputs.  I am not sure how 'real' the C-Bus coupler length
restriction is. It may be workable within one room to the 4 switches.
Probably a try it and see.
> I have used the VIOM before and I am very impressed, not tried the
NETIOM yet but it is high on my list of adaptable solutions, I have it in
mind for the gate at the end of the drive. By using a NETIOM (and a PC) the
lighting system would become a little too non standard.
>
The Netiom has less inbuilt 'smarts' than the Viom eg timers and input
to output interactions but of course has the Ethernet interface.which
allows you to do this remotely.
> I would be interested in using the solution you suggest 'on top of'
the C-Bus system to add additional intelligence. That is to say 'nice to
have' features rather than 'must have'. By that I mean light switches need
to be 99.99% reliable, adding a PC to the mix could reduce this figure
somewhat...
>
Absolutely :-)  - a lighting system must work 100% - and anything that
impacts that has to be an issue.  Hence why I've tried to stay embedded
for all but the very 'nice to have' features, usually ones that involve
rich data content (and hence a PC) or don't have any significant impact
if they were to fail due to a PC crash.   I was even asked to implement
a 'dim/restore the lights' in the kitchen for a couple of secs the other
day whenever one of a defined list of TV soaps was due to start....
(wouldn't mind if that failed !)  .

Now if the xAP C-Bus gateway had an input/output mapping function
inbuilt and embedded ....;-)


Kevin


> Regards
>
> Nigel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kevin Hawkins [mailto:lists@xxxxxxx]
> Sent: 01 February 2006 14:08
> To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [ukha_d] was: Re: Idratek - Serious Contender? Now:
Alternative to clipsal switches in C-Bus Install
>
>
> Nigel Giddings wrote:
>
>> The main driver for this is cost, secondly, as much as I like the
clipsal C-Bus switches they are only switches ...
>>
> Actually they are quite a bit more in practice. Aside from simple
ONOFF
> they can easily be set up for many actions including dimming, ramps,
> timers, scene triggers etc, and they have multi state feedback
> indicators.  Some switches have IR receivers too.  Most importantly
> depending on the model of switch they can also store and manage scenes
> on C-Bus.   C-Bus is also very intelligent with regard to any
> discrepancies it comes across (for example 2 switches think a light is
> ON but another switch and a dimmer thinks it's OFF, perhaps caused by
a
> glitch, or a network interruption).  There is an involved arbitration
> system that will resolve such inconsistencies that C-Bus switches
> participate in.  Also although it is fairly simple to send a
"Group XX
> to Level YY" onto C-Bus say via the PCI - something on C-Bus has
to
> maintain the group level and report it periodically , you can't create
> 'phantom' groups on C-Bus that are maintained like true C-Bus groups
> (arbitration/reporting/status etc) .  This means that some C-Bus
> hardware device has to have the group defined.
>
> One of the things I am doing is using xAP to control C-Bus - hence any
> switch that can generate a xAP command can control a C-Bus load.  The
> xAP Netiom for example has 16 inputs (which are debounced) and thus
can
> attach to 16 switches - for £70+VAT - also you get 16 outputs as well.
-
> usable for relays with C-Bus control.
> http://www.phaedrusltd.com/pages/html/netiom-xap.html
> What I don't know just yet is how immune these are to long distance
runs
> for the switches. If you can run the wires not alongside any mains
that
> would help of course.   For say 4 x 4 way switches in one room this
> might be worth considering. There are a couple of other things like
how
> to get dimming working based on momentary actions and how to map xAP
to
> C-Bus groups but all achievable (currently needs a PC application
helper).
>
> Kevin
>
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>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
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> 1/2/2006
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