Re: Automatic Generator cut in

[Frank Mc Alinden <fmcalind@xxxxxxx>]

Hi Mick

Personally i would have the monitoring a dedicated unit ie viom
board....The Contactors would have to be electrically interlocked so that
both cannot come on at the same time and even better to put a mech
interlock between them...Also the change over should not happen i think
until the genny is up and running so either a dwell or speed monitor
required.......If the viom board is not stand alone i have a pic based 8in
8 out  board i can give you ...just let me know your requirements

Good Luck

Frank.....
----- Original Message -----
From: Mick Furlong
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 10:05 AM
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] Automatic Generator cut in


Frank

I am pretty certain the UPS knows when the power comes back and
communicates
it to the software on the server, from there it is just a lil bit of work
to
get it into the HA software. However it might be better if I used the viom
and some sort of current sensing circuit to switch everything. This would
take the PC and the UPS out of the decision loop and limit the points of
failure. The HA server could still be aware of the failure through both the
viom and the UPS but if it was kaput then the gennie would still cut in. I
am pretty sure the viom can work in standalone mode like this this once it
is programmed. Another possibility might be to use Comfort to monitor and
switch it all. Unfortunately I can't try all this until the new house is
finished....only a couple of months to go!

I will sketch it out and see if it makes sense.

Cheers for the help
Mick

-----Original Message-----
From: Frank Mc Alinden [mailto:fmcalind@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 10 May 2003 00:51
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Automatic Generator cut in


Hi Mick
What  *i think* you would need is a security power supply (13.8v)
with a battery backup and this would be used for the control circuit to
trigger the mains /generator contactors via your viom relays..Iwould switch
12v dc via the viom module and drive and slave 12v relay powered by the
security power supply ( mains rated contacts on the slave relays) located
with the mains / generator contactors....

The ups software would have to send a message to ha software to indicate
power restored to switch back to mains....can this be done ???

Frank
----- Original Message -----
From: Mick Furlong
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 9:42 AM
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] Automatic Generator cut in


Frank

I think Mark's is a manual cutover ...

I know I can get an electric start generator (which I assume has a
battery
to start it?) and I think you are right about needing some form of dry
contacts.

With regards the triggering I would hope to use the fact that the UPS
knows
it has lost power and has communicated it to the server to initiate the
sequence via a viom maybe.

If I can get a gennie that has some sort of dry contact I think I can
figure
that bit out...how on earth do I get the contactors to cut over and back
on
the return of mains power? I sort of lose it about there;)

Cheers Mick
-----Original Message-----
From: Frank Mc Alinden [mailto:fmcalind@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 10 May 2003 00:16
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ukha_d] Automatic Generator cut in


Hi Mick
I did a generator autostart for a Security Company a few
years
back but cant remember exactly how it was done.....

Mark Mc Call has a generator set but im not sure if his starts
automatically ......

I would imagine the generator would obviously have some dry contact
input
to start initiate a startup sequence and a standby battery to start
it....it
would be  triggered by a phase failure relay and maybe a timer....which
monitors the mains.....

You would also need contactors to switch the load between mains supply
+
generator supply....Should have kept the schematics ;-((

Frank


Frank


----- Original Message -----
From: Mick Furlong
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2003 8:24 AM
Subject: [ukha_d] Automatic Generator cut in


OK something on topic for a change;)

Scenario is as follows.....

Generator in outside boilerhouse

3xUPS (one with interface to Server PC) inside main house running
some
lighting and some computer/networking kit.

Every imaginable cable type running between the boiler house and the
main
house and a duct to run more if needed.

Questions are...
How do I get the generator to autostart if there is a mains failure?
Do I need a special generator (I haven't picked one yet)?
I believe the wiring needs to be isolated from the mains when the
generator
is running how do I do this automatically?
How do I get the system to cut over to the mains once the power is
back?
Finally how do I do all of this on a reasonable budget?

Thanks in advance for any ideas
Mick






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