RE: TiVo question

["Keith Doxey" <lists.diyha@xxxxxxx>]

I wonder what the legal position is if someone bought an early TiVo to
use
as a manual recorder and now cant ?

Does the firmware upgrade happen automatically or would a user have to
initiate it themselves?
Keith 
www.diyha.co.uk 
www.kat5.tv 
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Harrison [mailto:Mark.Harrison@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 04 April 2002 16:50
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question


Mark,

The TiVo _WAS_ marketed as something capabale of manual operation. This is
a
feature that has now been disabled!
Mark Harrison 
Head of Systems, eKingfisher 
-----Original Message-----
From: Stainton-James, Mark (London) [mailto:stainmar@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 4 April 2002 16:37
To: 'ukha_d@xxxxxxx'
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question


>However, if I bought a TiVo, I'd expect to be able to use it
manually,
without the sub in some circumstances (like - because I was building a
fully
integrated Home Entertainment >system and wanted something else to glue
it
together.)

But TiVo is not marketed or sold as a HDD player/recorder.  It is the
whole
TiVo concept that you are buying into with your purchase. TiVo are
quite
clear up front that your product will be severely disabled without a
subscription.  

TiVo's financial model seems to be akin to mobile phones operators models
-
i.e. subsidise the hardware cost and charge a subscription.  If you
don't
pay a subscription then your phone is limited (maybe incoming calls only
/
only useful as a door stop).  There can not be any markup on the
TiVo
hardware, although I agree they probably aren't making a loss on the
hardware either. 

Mark


-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Harrison [mailto:Mark.Harrison@xxxxxxx] 
Sent: 04 April 2002 16:29
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question

Yeah... email lag, eh?

Personally, if I bought a TiVo, then I'd take out the sub. My question
about
"over the net" was about bandwidth utilisation, not about
information
piracy...

However, if I bought a TiVo, I'd expect to be able to use it manually,
without the sub in some circumstances (like - because I was building a
fully
integrated Home Entertainment system and wanted something else to glue
it
together.)
Mark Harrison 
Head of Systems, eKingfisher 
-----Original Message-----
From: Don McAllister [mailto:donmc@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 4 April 2002 16:20
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question
Mark, presume my response to Kevin crossed in Yahoospace.
Misunderstanding
as to the nature of the exercise. Now cleared up and I for one would be
more
than happy to see a way of linking 2 TiVos together!!

Cheers
Don

-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Harrison [mailto:Mark.Harrison@xxxxxxx] 
Sent: 04 April 2002 16:00
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question

Don,

Why should we take this discussion off-list?

TiVo sell two things: 

- A piece of hardware
- A data feed

If it were a discussion about "how could one get the TiVo data feed
without
paying them", then this would be different. It would be a discussion
of
piracy, plain and simple, and this list is no place for it.

It's not - it's a discussion of "how can one use the TiVo hardware
without
using their data feed", then that's different. The TiVo hardware is
sold,
standalone, and while it's obviously got a tremendous value-add from
using
the data feed, it's certainly not the only way to use it, or the only
way
forward.
Mark Harrison 
Head of Systems, eKingfisher 
-----Original Message-----
From: Don McAllister [mailto:donmc@xxxxxxx]
Sent: 4 April 2002 14:32
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question
Guys, Without a subscription the machine is next to useless. You cannot
manually set up recordings all you can do is capture the 30mins live TV
cache and nothing else, zippo.

The whole concept of the TiVo is based on the subscription and the
automatic
download of the enriched (!) TV listings. I know it sounds a lot but it
really is worth the outlay to get the sub.

As someone else mentioned, the discussion of subscription dodging is
frowned
upon in the TiVo forums. Whilst it probably is technically achievable, it
is
not encouraged. This is presumably to stop people taking revenue from
TiVo
to ensure they remain in business and develop the platform. 

If you wish to continue discussing bypassing subscription charges, can
you
take it off list please.

Ta



-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Mc Aree [mailto:michael.mcaree@xxxxxxx] 
Sent: 04 April 2002 14:20
To: ukha_d@xxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [ukha_d] TiVo question

    Actually I am thinking about using Digiguide with a bit
of programming
to automatically send the IR commands to a Tivo without a subscription 

Not sure how this will help. I thought that you could not add manual
recordings without a subscription. What IR commands are you planning to
send?




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